Cations inhibit specifically type I 5 alpha-reductase...

[squeegee]

OK guys! Let's talk!! For guys that were sleeping for the last few weeks please read that first:

viewtopic.php?f=23&t=46991&start=0

Hair Loss Study Abstract: Cations inhibit specifically type I 5 alpha-reductase found in human skin.

Title
Cations inhibit specifically type I 5 alpha-reductase found in human skin.
Author
Sugimoto Y; López-Solache I; Labrie F; Luu-The V
Address
Medical Research Council Group in Molecular Endocrinology, CHUL Research Center, Quebec, Canada.
Source
J Invest Dermatol, 104: 5, 1995 May, 775-8
Abstract
Steroid 5 alpha-reductase catalyzes the reduction of testosterone into the very potent androgen dihydrotestosterone. Previously, we showed that human type I 5 alpha-reductase is expressed mainly in the skin, whereas a type II 5 alpha-reductase is more specifically expressed in the prostate. To assess the possible differential effects of various cations on the two types of 5 alpha-reductase, we constructed expression vectors and transfected them into SW-13 cells, a human adrenal carcinoma cell line containing negligible endogenous 5 alpha-reductase activity. The expressed 5 alpha-reductases were analyzed for their sensitivity to Li, Ca, Cd, Cu, Mg, Mn, Ni, Zn, and Fe. The results showed that type I 5 alpha-reductase was strongly inhibited by Cd, Cu, and Zn and moderately inhibited by Ni and Fe, with 50% inhibitory concentration values of 0.9, 1.9, 2.0, 169.2, and 174.3 microM, respectively. In contrast, type II 5 alpha-reductase activity was inhibited only by Cu, with a 50% inhibitory concentration value of 19.2 microM. The data showed that cations could specifically control 5 alpha-reductase activity expression, which is more strongly inhibited in a target tissue, especially the skin.
Language of Publication
English
Unique Identifier
95256633



As stupid it can be, this stuff can help your hairloss problem! http://www.downy.com/en_US/products/ultraliquid.jsp



Fred

 

[phish]

we dont like type 2 dht on this forum. I firmly believe hair loss is a 95 percent type 2 dht issue. Reason i say this is because merk tested a type 1 inhibitor and it didn't do anything, also people have genetic disability to not make typ2 and never go bald but still have normal type 1. However dht1 is good to block for acne.

 

[squeegee]

The enzyme 5 alpha reductase converts testosterone into dihydrotestosterone (DHT) and it is DHT that is most potent androgen in promoting androgenetic alopecia – the medical term for male pattern balding and Female Balding. The enzyme was first discovered in the male prostate where it catalyzes the conversion of testosterone to dihydrotestosterone, which in turn binds to the androgen receptor and initiates development of the external genitalia and prostate, and is also responsible for prostate enlargement.

Later, 5-alpha reductase was also found in human scalp hair follicles and elsewhere in the skin, where it carries out the same reaction as in the prostate. It is thought that disturbances in 5-alpha reductase activity in skin cells might contribute to male pattern baldness, acne, or hirsutism.

There are at least two 5 alpha reductase isoenzymes, type I and type II. They are active in different regions of the body, but they both produce DHT that can circulate throughout the body and exert effects in organs other than that where the DHT was produced.

There are two types of 5 alpha reductase enzyme each coded by a separate gene and each produced by different tissues, the genes for 5-alpha reductase has been mapped to chromosome 5. Although both may be important in pattern baldness development, type I 5 alpha reductase may be more important because it is highly active in scalp skin and hair follicle sebaceous glands. It produces 60% to 70% of the total DHT in our bodies. Type II produces the remaining 30% to 40% of DHT.

It has been observed that levels of type II 5 alpha reductase in the outer root sheath of scalp hair follicles is less as compared to Type I so it is believed that local activity of both type I and type II 5 alpha reductase which contributes to androgenetic alopecia development.

 

[phish]

if that were the case y do the propecia trials say after 5 years 90 percent had same or better hair then they started with. If type 1 was a factor surely 90 percent wouldn't maintain hair on a drug that only blocks type 2.

 

[squeegee]

I am talking about a topical treatment not orally. :dunno:

 

[phish]

yea and if something doesn't work orally how is it going to work topically :dunno: in thoery it could work but there has been tons of things that have blocked type 1 dht topically and didnt amount to much. what we need is something like andro science is making that destroys the dht receptors on the scalp.

 

[Bryan]

There are at least two 5 alpha reductase isoenzymes, type I and type II. They are active in different regions of the body, but they both produce DHT that can circulate throughout the body and exert effects in organs other than that where the DHT was produced.

DHT isn't much of an endocrine hormone, and I've discussed the evidence for that for YEARS on hairloss sites!

There are two types of 5 alpha reductase enzyme each coded by a separate gene and each produced by different tissues, the genes for 5-alpha reductase has been mapped to chromosome 5. Although both may be important in pattern baldness development, type I 5 alpha reductase may be more important because it is highly active in scalp skin and hair follicle sebaceous glands.

As "phish" pointed out, a specific type I inhibitor was tested on both humans and stumptailed macaques, and found to be ineffective at stopping male pattern baldness. The type II enzyme is clearly the one that most needs to be inhibited, by far.

It produces 60% to 70% of the total DHT in our bodies. Type II produces the remaining 30% to 40% of DHT.

Where on earth did you get THAT idea?? The Gisleskog et al studies on finasteride and dutasteride that I've been posting about and discussing for years on hairloss sites found that the type II enzyme produces about 82% of the body's DHT, with the type I enzyme producing the rest.

It has been observed that levels of type II 5 alpha reductase in the outer root sheath of scalp hair follicles is less as compared to Type I so it is believed that local activity of both type I and type II 5 alpha reductase which contributes to androgenetic alopecia development.

See Happle and Hoffman's important study titled "Finasteride is the main inhibitor of 5alpha-reductase activity in microdissected dermal papillae of human hair follicles". A specific type I inhibitor had no consistent effect on that activity at all.

 

[squeegee]

Sorry guys! I am just trying to find why Downy can work for hair loss.. :sobbing:

 

[harold]

Study still has some value.

"In contrast, type II 5 alpha-reductase activity was inhibited only by Cu, with a 50% inhibitory concentration value of 19.2 microM."

hh

 

[JayB]

Study still has some value.

"In contrast, type II 5 alpha-reductase activity was inhibited only by Cu, with a 50% inhibitory concentration value of 19.2 microM."

hh

a shampoo with copper peptides should have more impressive results if thats the case

 

[harold]

Study still has some value.

"In contrast, type II 5 alpha-reductase activity was inhibited only by Cu, with a 50% inhibitory concentration value of 19.2 microM."

hh

a shampoo with copper peptides should have more impressive results if thats the case

Wouldnt think so. 19.2 micromoles makes it not that strong an inhibitor. And I am guessing the whole point of copper peptides is that the copper is bound in a peptide and not in the form of copper ions as what they are talking about here.
hh

 

[Bryan]

Wouldnt think so. 19.2 micromoles makes it not that strong an inhibitor.

???

Not that strong, compared to WHAT?? I find that to be a rather curious statement, Harold. No, it's not very strong compared to finasteride and dutasteride, which have 50% inhibition values in the NANO-molar range, but that doesn't mean that something that's "only" a 19.2 micromole inhibitor can't be useful. For example, fatty acids have similar inhibition ratings: gamma-linolenic acid around 10 micromoles, and linoleic acid around 100 micromoles. Both GLA and LA have been shown to be effective local 5a-reductase inhibitors when applied topically in the right doses to hamster flank organs.

And I am guessing the whole point of copper peptides is that the copper is bound in a peptide and not in the form of copper ions as what they are talking about here.

Exactly. Copper peptides aren't copper ions!

 

[harold]

Wouldnt think so. 19.2 micromoles makes it not that strong an inhibitor.

???

Not that strong, compared to WHAT?? I find that to be a rather curious statement, Harold. No, it's not very strong compared to finasteride and dutasteride, which have 50% inhibition values in the NANO-molar range, but that doesn't mean that something that's "only" a 19.2 micromole inhibitor can't be useful.

Well I was thinking not very strong in the context of JayBs statement - that a shampoo for a couple of minutes with something copperish would be expected to have dramatic effects if the study were true.

For example, fatty acids have similar inhibition ratings: gamma-linolenic acid around 10 micromoles, and linoleic acid around 100 micromoles. Both GLA and LA have been shown to be effective local 5a-reductase inhibitors when applied topically in the right doses to hamster flank organs.

And I am guessing the whole point of copper peptides is that the copper is bound in a peptide and not in the form of copper ions as what they are talking about here.

Exactly. Copper peptides aren't copper ions!

 

[Harie]

Sorry guys! I am just trying to find why Downy can work for hair loss.. :sobbing:

It works because it locally inhibits lots of 5ar1 and some 5ar2. Since finasteride already works great on 5ar2, maybe the additional 19.2 micromoles of local inhibition (5ar2) combined with the great amt of 5ar1 inhibition really helps?

I wonder what percentage of DHT conversion 19 micro-moles is equal to? Per what Brian said, 18% of DHT conversion is caused by 5ar1...So IMO cations will still help. And even if they don't, it's an awesome and cheap conditioner!