Men With Persistent Sexual Symptoms After Finasteride Show No Evidence Of Androgen Deficiency

Grasshüpfer

Grasshüpfer

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I wonder how that goes together with the anecdotes of pfs guys who stopped balding even without finasteride.
@Admin for example.

Balding is for sure not an neuronal issue.
 
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Alk

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No its not its just saying the sides are not because of hormone deficiency which was known but there were not many studys to conclude it.
 
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ahmed wolf

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thats kind of good news knowing yhat our androgen receptor didnt died lol
so it's depression that cuz these side effects or the fear of not being normal again i heard stories about depression before but never though it was this powerful
i took gin for 3 days got sides now i am off it for 3 weeks slight improvements thank god i hope i reach a full recovery soon
thanx for ur post really helpful
 
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abcdefg

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It makes sense though because if finasteride changes neurosteroid levels through 5-ar 3 then that might affect ED issues and not the actual drop in DHT. We just dont know enough, and might die not knowing the answers. Mental effects do factor into ED not just physical ones
 
rclark

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That was a good article.

What it said was men who had PFS had depression, and "abnormal brain chemistry" (exact words).

That might be true. Would imagine they didn't have a large pool of men to study, but could be wrong
about that.
 
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Alk

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ahmed wolf said:
thats kind of good news knowing yhat our androgen receptor didnt died lol
so it's depression that cuz these side effects or the fear of not being normal again i heard stories about depression before but never though it was this powerful
i took gin for 3 days got sides now i am off it for 3 weeks slight improvements thank god i hope i reach a full recovery soon
thanx for ur post really helpful
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I dont think this is the conclusion thats made. The problem is that finastrade can cause depression, aswell as balding. Depression and anxiety can then cause sexual symptoms. For the small percentage that finastrade causes depression through neurological imbalance it is then hard to tell if their sexual symptoms are then caused by the depression or other neurological symptoms from finasteride, much like those who have sexual symptoms from taking ssri's or ant-idepressants (post-ssri sexual dysfunction, pssd). We do know that theres no androgen deficiency in the group from this example. Thats kinda the conclusion i made.

There are also many examples of men with pfs that no longer lose hair and those who do have a significant change in hormones. Still a lot to learn.
 
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ahmed wolf

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Alk said:
I dont think this is the conclusion thats made. The problem is that finastrade can cause depression, aswell as balding. Depression and anxiety can then cause sexual symptoms. For the small percentage that finastrade causes depression through neurological imbalance it is then hard to tell if their sexual symptoms are then caused by the depression or other neurological symptoms from finasteride, much like those who have sexual symptoms from taking ssri's or ant-idepressants (post-ssri sexual dysfunction, pssd). We do know that theres no androgen deficiency in the group from this example. Thats kinda the conclusion i made.

There are also many examples of men with pfs that no longer lose hair and those who do have a significant change in hormones. Still a lot to learn.
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I understand that its not that simple but again for men that stopped balding with pfs I think it depends on how much and how long they took so there androgen receptors got less sensitive to dht but again the study shows no androgen deficiency rather its a neurological imbalance
also look at bodybuilders that abused anabolic steroids for years their should suffer from this neurological imbalance that will lead them to sexual dysfunction but modt of them recoverd i have seen duds at tje gym eating dbol or androl like candy and they dont even know what pct means and still recoverd with out doing any but it took time
 
rclark

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Personally I believe PFS is real. And scientists don't really know the effects.

It's five percent, at least. That's just what I personally believe. Most men won't have sides,
but some will.
 
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ahmed wolf

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David_MPN said:
@Admin is the tail end of the distribution.

Most PFS guys have normal hormone levels. A few don't.
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so its caused by mental issues? if most men have normal hormone levels or finasteride did some damage to the nerve system in our bodies that most of the studies didnt bother investigating in that area ?
 
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ahmed wolf

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rclark said:
Personally I believe PFS is real. And scientists don't really know the effects.

It's five percent, at least. That's just what I personally believe. Most men won't have sides,
but some will.
Click to expand...
yes i think its real but i think it depends on how long u took it and what mental and physical state u were in when u took it
 
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Alk

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ahmed wolf said:
I understand that its not that simple but again for men that stopped balding with pfs I think it depends on how much and how long they took so there androgen receptors got less sensitive to dht but again the study shows no androgen deficiency rather its a neurological imbalance
also look at bodybuilders that abused anabolic steroids for years their should suffer from this neurological imbalance that will lead them to sexual dysfunction but modt of them recoverd i have seen duds at tje gym eating dbol or androl like candy and they dont even know what pct means and still recoverd with out doing any but it took time
Click to expand...

But bodybuilders are injecting hormones and finasteride blocks 5ar which does more than just turn test into dht, it has a purpose in the brain. In the case of those slowly losing hair and those who stop losing hair all together, maybe thats a receptor problem. In the study they tested androgen action but not the receptor itself. Atleast thats what i got from it, i cant get the full study.
 
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ahmed wolf

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rclark said:
Personally I believe PFS is real. And scientists don't really know the effects.

It's five percent, at least. That's just what I personally believe. Most men won't have sides,
but some will.
Click to expand...
yes i think its real but i think it depends on how long u took it and what mental and physical state u were in when u took it
Alk said:
But bodybuilders are injecting hormones and finasteride blocks 5ar which does more than just turn test into dht, it has a purpose in the brain. In the case of those slowly losing hair and those who stop losing hair all together, maybe thats a receptor problem. In the study they tested androgen action but not the receptor itself. Atleast thats what i got from it, i cant get the full study.
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i understand but high dose of hormones should damege the receptors or make the receptors less sinsitve after stop using but that never happened
sure inhibiting 5ra is bad but it wont kill the receptors look at ppl taking finasteride for 15 years they should look like they are having chemo therpy on they are dying from unknown disease it there receptors stopped recognizing androgens
 
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Alk

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ahmed wolf said:
yes i think its real but i think it depends on how long u took it and what mental and physical state u were in when u took it

i understand but high dose of hormones should damege the receptors or make the receptors less sinsitve after stop using but that never happened
sure inhibiting 5ra is bad but it wont kill the receptors look at ppl taking finasteride for 15 years they should look like they are having chemo therpy on they are dying from unknown disease it there receptors stopped recognizing androgens
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No thats not what would happen at all, there is a condition where boys are born without 5ar (5ard) and they dont look like their dying from a disease or on chemo. finasteride wouldnt damage all of ur receptors, we dont know if it even damages the ones recepting dht because for a majority it doesnt.
 
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ahmed wolf

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Alk said:
No thats not what would happen at all, there is a condition where boys are born without 5ar (5ard) and they dont look like their dying from a disease or on chemo. finasteride wouldnt damage all of ur receptors, we dont know if it even damages the ones recepting dht because for a majority it doesnt.
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thats y I think pfs is not permanent and if someone wanr to try the drug they should have a full health check but again i think its a strong drug that effects mental area more thane the physical one cuz u will always fear the unknown of what will happen to u if u kerp using and sadly the internet is full of these stories
 
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Alk

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Some ppl recover some dont, whats the difference if its not permenant if by the time you recover ya too old to use ya willy.
 
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abcdefg

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finasteride alters brain chemistry. that is where this problem stems from IMO it has nothing to do with its target effect of reducing DHT
DHT has no known effect in the brain but the 5 ar 2 enzyme might and if it lowers 5 ar 3 that might be involved there too. Its just a side effect of finasteride that no one knew about at the time.
 
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