Oops! Nizoral only is as strong as minoxidil 2% 1x per day!

CCS

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Yeah, please disregard the following, pages, and jump to the last one and read what Bryan said. Or just look at the new title.



Nizoral grows as much hair as 2% minoxidil, which regrows more than Avodart in 6 months. That said, why is Nizoral considered to not make or break a regimen, especially if some that hair growth is from anti-androgenic activity? Since we don't have 5 year data on Nizoral, you should take finasteride or dutasteride as well. But I'm just saying you should use Nizoral if you can. Why not? It is a big deal.

If 5 minutes 2x per week grows as much hair as minoxidil 4 hours 14x per week, what does that say about 5 minute shower doses?
 

hoople

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Because Nizoral isn't marketed as a hair loss treatment, the company gets its profit from the product being sold as a dandruff treatment. Were it to be marketed as a hairloss treatment then it would receive as much attention and hyping as rogaine does.

I find it incredible that it is as effective as 2% minoxidil, I also find it incredible that my Androgenetic Alopecia is still winning despite me using 5% minoxidil, 2% nizoral, and topical spironolactone. Hmph.
 

Pondle

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Yeah but did these various studies use the same methodology to assess hair growth? I don't think that the nizoral study provided full hair count data...
 

CCS

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I don't know about all three of them, but one of them I read the abstract to yesterday measured hair count and diameter and said it was the same as 2% minoxidil. They were comparing it to the minoxidil people in THEIR study though, not the huge Rogain trial. Still, it was an independent study, even if small. They also had a placebo that lost hair in that same time.
 

CCS

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Bubka just asked me about my posts about this. I took the time to write him a long PM, so I'm posting a copy here:
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I did not say it is BETTER. Just that it regrew more hair in the 6 month trials. We know dutasteride slows male pattern baldness, and minoxidil does not, but maybe Nizoral also slows male pattern baldness.

Here is my reasoning:

dutasteride < 2% min = nizoral

Sources:

There were 3 independent studies with nizoral. One compared it to other anti-dandruff shampoos and recorded hair counts. Another compared it to 2% minoxidil and placebo (studies love usually compare stuff to minoxidil. even the tricomin study had a 2% minoxidil group. I don't remember the 3rd one, but Bryan mentioned it. The nizoral 1% and 2% both regrew the same amount of hair as the 2% minoxidil, and had the same effect on hair diameter in that study, and the results were statistically similar to other minoxidil studies.

There have been numerous studies with minoxidil at various concenrations over the years. They show that in 6 months, 2% minoxidil regrows a certain number of hairs (varies by study, and some are just 1 year studies whose results must be cut in half for comparison). The regrowth numbers are consistently higher than the 100 hairs that dutasteride regrew. I think at all of them said the 2% minoxidil regrew at least 120 hairs, with some 5% studies going over 200.




I can vouch from my own experience with Minoxidil and Propecia that while Propecia maintained my hair for 4 years, only minoxidil gave me dramatic results after 2 months that went away when I got off and came back again when I got off again. I stopped only because of the greasy hassel.
 

bubka

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i am still missing the point how

"dutasteride < 2% min = nizoral" is this from your own "personal" results, how does nizoral grow more hair than dutasteride and thus more than finasteride???
 

CCS

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bubka said:
"dutasteride < 2% min = nizoral" is this from your own "personal" results, how does nizoral grow more hair than dutasteride and thus more than finasteride???

Did you even read the above post? I said there were 3 independent Nizoral studies, at least one of which had minoxidil in it, and there were tens of minoxidil studies. I only mentioned my personal results to back up what the studies said.
 

CCS

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Got a PM from some guy asking if he should stop finasteride. Here was my response:



Do not stop finasteride. My point was that Everyone should use Nizoral 1%, and that it is a BIG part of the big 3 and should not be sneezed at like some people have been doing.

We don't have 5 year data for Nizoral. We know Propecia saves your hair, and that while 2% minoxidil regrows way more hair than dutasteride in 6 months, and a year of minoxidil mor ethan that, minoxidil does not maintain hair long term. Propecia does, and we can assume dutasteride does too. Who knows what nizoral will do, though I suspect it maintains better than minoxdil since it seems to have anti-androgenic properties.



Final observation. Acrylic acid is the first ingredient after water, and is an anti-oxidiant used to stableize the keto. Many anti-oxidants are known to regrow hair. Since keto 1% and 2% both regrow the same amount of hair, I suspect the "inactive ingedient" acrylic acid may play an important role. So I buy nizoral, not generics without acrylic acid.
 

bubka

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where are the studies, where is the study that says nizoral grows more hair than dutasteride, you say this, where can we actually read this?
 

stampede

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Yeah, can we have links to some ketoconazole studies? I have seen one of them but don't remember where it was.
 

CCS

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CCS

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Nizoral

Originally Nizoral was only available by prescription as an anti-dandruff shampoo. The active ingredient in Nizoral is Ketoconazole, and is now available over the counter with 1% ketoconzole, as opposed to the 2% in the prescription formulation.

It has recently been shown that the benefits of Nizoral far exceed that of dandruff relief. It has long been known that Ketoconzole in the 2% solution has had some benefit for people suffering from androgenetic alopecia. On March 4, 2001 at the American Academy of Dermatology Meeting, scientists working for McNeil, makers of Nizoral, revealed that the 1% version provides similar benefits.
An anti-dandruff shampoo like Nizoral should be used anyways by men and women who use topical treatments such as Rogaine because it relieves any itchiness or dryness as well as dandruff.


Ingredients
Active Ingredients: Contains: Ketoconazole (1 %)
Inactive Ingredients: Water, Sodium Laureth Sulfate, Cocamide MEA, Sodium Cocoyl Sarcosinate, Glycol Distearate, Acrylic Acid Polymer (Carbomer 1342), Fragrance, Sodium Chloride, Tetrasodium EDTA, Butylated Hydroxytoluene, Quaternium -15, Polyquaternium-7, Sodium Hydroxide, Hydrochloric Acid, FD&C Blue No. 1


Studies

March 04, 2001 - American Academy of Dermatology Meeting - Washington DC - Scientists working for McNeil, makers of Nizoral anti-dandruff shampoo, presented the findings of a study done on 1% Nizoral shampoo which has good news for hair loss sufferers. It has long been known that 2% prescription Nizoral has beneficial effects on Androgenic Alopecia (male pattern baldness). It however has been unclear whether the same benefits can be obtained by using the non-prescription 1% version.
In the study presented (see below), one hundred male volunteers with mild to moderate dandruff and somewhat oily scalp, were using, in a double-blind fashion, either a 1% Nizoral shampoo or a 1% zinc pyrithione shampoo, 2-3 times a week for 6 months.
Analysis of the different parameters set up in the study shows that the hair diameter gradually increased with Nizoral use (+8.46%) over a 6 month period, whereas the diameter showed a trend to decrease with zinc pyrithione use over the same period (-2.28%). The sebum excretion rate was reduced with Nizoral (-6.54%) while it increased with zinc pyrithione (+8.2%) over the same period of time. The number of hair shed over a 24-hour period was reduced by 16.46% with Nizoral and 6.02% with zinc pyrithione after 6 months. Finally, the percentage hairs in anagen phase increased by 6.4% and 8.4% respectively during the study time.

The results are similar to a previous study done on 2% prescription strength Nizoral where it was shown that use of 2% Nizoral yielded a 7% average increase in hair shaft diameter similar to what was achieved by the control group using 2% Minoxidil and a non-medicated shampoo.

So for any hair loss sufferer, this research clearly indicates that using 1% or 2% Nizoral 2-3 times per week, will have positive effects on hair growth as well as controlling dandruff. It is still unclear at this time whether it's the anti-fungal properties or the anti-androgenic properties of Ketokonazole (active ingredient in Nizoral) thats responsible for the hair thickening effects, however because of the decrease in sebum rates as well, it is the authors opinion that the results are due to the anti-androgenic properties of Ketokonazole.


The effects of chronic use of 1% ketoconazole or a 1% zinc pyrithione shampoo on the general health of hair and scalp.

G. Piérard 1and G. Cauwenbergh2
1. Dept Dermatopathology, University of Liège, Belgium; 2. Skin research Center, Johnson &Johnson , Skillman, N.J., USA

Hundred male volunteers with mild to moderate dandruff and somewhat oily scalp, have used, in a double-blind fashion, a 1% ketoconazole shampoo or a 1% zinc pyrithione shampoo. The test shampoos were applied 2 to 3 times weekly for a total period of 6 months. Several parameters that affect the general health of hair and scalp were assessed at start, and after 1, 3 and 6 months. These parameters included the percent of hairs in anagen phase, the diameter of the hairs, sebum excretion rate at the hairline, and the number of hairs shed in the 24-hour period prior to each assessment. At the end of the study, the partints were asked to complete a questionnaire regarding the cosmetic acceptability of the test shampoos.

Forty-four ketoconazole users and forty-three zinc pyrithione users completed the 6 month study period. Analysis of the different parameters shows that the hair diameter gradually increases with chronic ketoconazole use (+8.46%) over a 6 month period, whereas the diameter shows a trend to decrease with zinc pyrithione use over the same period (-2.28%). The sebum excretion rate is reduced with ketoconazole (-6.54%) while it increases with zinc pyrithione (+8.2%) over the same period of time. The number of hair shed over a 24-hour period is reduced by 16.46% with ketoconazole and 6.02% with zinc pyrithione after 6 months. Finally, the percentage hairs in anagen phase increased by 6.4% and 8.4% respectively during the study time. Except for the percentage of hairs in anagen, which showed no difference between the two groups, all other parameters were significantly different in favor of the ketoconazole shampoo.
Both shampoos have been shown to be good anti-dandruff ingredients. Assessment of parameters than can affect the health of hair and scalp, suggests that both ingredients show distinct differences in the way they affect the scalp; indicating that ketoconazole increases hair diameter and reduces scalp oil, whereas zinc pyrithione seems to yield opposite effects. This suggests that, besides their effect on the lipophilic yeast Malassezia spp, ketoconazole and zinc pyrithione act though quite different mechanisms. An overall analysis of hair diameter changes as a function of changes in sebum excretion rate suggests that a reduction in scalp oiliness seems to result in an increased hair diameter. This suggests that, in people with oily hair, regular use of ketoconazole shampoo may result in overall hair fullness.
 

CCS

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http://www.hairloss-reversible.com/disc ... 1152855158

According to Kevin(from Keratin) there is a new study which confirmed the efficacy of KCZ as a hair growth stimulant. This study has been presented only in conferences so far. This is the abstruct for the SID conference held in April 2003. (Thought i'd share this info with u all)

CATEGORY: Hair and Cutaneous Development
TITLE: Stimulation of hair growth in a C3H/HeN mouse model by topical application of ketoconazole
AUTHORS (ALL): Tsuboi, Ryoji2; Ko, K1; Kojima, Yuko1; Ogawa, Hideoki1

ABSTRACT BODY: Ketoconazole (KCZ) is an imidazole anti-mycotic agent, and its topical application is also effective for treating seborrheic dermatitis and dandruff. Recently, topical use of KCZ 2% shampoo was reported clinically to have a therapeutic effect for androgenic alopecia. The present study was conducted to examine statistically the stimulatory effect of KCZ on hair growth in a mouse model. Coat hairs on the dorsal skin of seven week old male C3H/HeN mice were gently clipped, and either 2% KCZ solution in ethanol (EtOH) or 1% EtOH was topically applied once daily for three weeks. The clipped area was photographed every other day, and the ratio of re-grown coat area was then calculated. The results demonstrated that KCZ had a clinically significant stimulatory effect on days 15, 18 and 21 compared with the vehicle group (p<0.05, n=8 ). Repeated experiments showed similar effects, confirming the efficacy of KCZ as a hair growth stimulant. Although the therapeutic mechanism of KCZ for hair growth is unclear at this moment, our results suggest that topical applications of the substance are useful for treating seborrheic dermatitis accompanied by hair regression or androgenetic alopecia.


Dermatology 1998;196(4):474-7 Ketoconazole shampoo: effect of long-term use in androgenic alopecia. Pierard-Franchimont C, De Doncker P, Cauwenbergh G, Pierard GE.

BACKGROUND: The pathogenesis of androgenic alopecia is not fully understood. A microbial-driven inflammatory reaction abutting on the hair follicles might participate in the hair status anomaly. OBJECTIVE: The aim of our study was to determine if ketoconazole (KCZ) which is active against the scalp microflora and shows some intrinsic anti-inflammatory activity might improve alopecia. METHOD: The effect of 2% KCZ shampoo was compared to that of an unmedicated shampoo used in combination with or without 2% minoxidil therapy. RESULTS: Hair density and size and proportion of anagen follicles were improved almost similarly by both KCZ and minoxidil regimens. The sebum casual level appeared to be decreased by KCZ. CONCLUSION: Comparative data suggest that there may be a significant action of KCZ upon the course of androgenic alopecia and that Malassezia spp. may play a role in the inflammatory reaction. The clinical significance of the results awaits further controlled study in a larger group of subjects.
 

CCS

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I'm really bothered more people are not arguing with me on this. Does that mean people agree, and will stop belittling Nizoral?
 

ginner

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I don't think there is any doubt that ketoconazole is a helpful treatment for male pattern baldness. I can't find the study that says it's just as effective as dutasteride though. Sorry if I missed it. Would you be able to point me to it?

There is a study showing that 2.5mg dutasteride increases hair count more than 5mg finasteride (Journal of the American Academy of Dermatology, 2006 Dec, 55(6):1014-23). There is also a study showing that finasteride + minoxidil was slightly better than finasteride + keto but both were better than finasteride alone. finasteride was better than minoxidil (The Journal of dermatology, 2002 Aug, 29(8):489-98). I don't know of a study comparing keto on its own to other treatments though.
 

Bryan

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collegechemistrystudent said:
I don't know about all three of them, but one of them I read the abstract to yesterday measured hair count and diameter and said it was the same as 2% minoxidil.

Keep in mind, though, that they only used a single application per day of 2% minoxidil in that 1998 Nizoral study, so I would use a certain amount of caution when comparing Nizoral to minoxidil and (by extension) to Avodart.
 

CCS

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Bryan said:
collegechemistrystudent said:
I don't know about all three of them, but one of them I read the abstract to yesterday measured hair count and diameter and said it was the same as 2% minoxidil.

Keep in mind, though, that they only used a single application per day of 2% minoxidil in that 1998 Nizoral study, so I would use a certain amount of caution when comparing Nizoral to minoxidil and (by extension) to Avodart.

:shock: Woops! I'll make corrections where needed!
 

stampede

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collegechemistrystudent said:
I'm really bothered more people are not arguing with me on this. Does that mean people agree, and will stop belittling Nizoral?

I've never belittled it.

I reckon that, if you can tolerate it (some people can't), you should use it for sure. It's cheap and effective.
 

bubka

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collegechemistrystudent said:
I'm really bothered more people are not arguing with me on this. Does that mean people agree, and will stop belittling Nizoral?
it's because we know you like to have an attention whoring post every day where you post replies to yourself 10x in a raw, this is not an exception
 

stampede

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bubka said:
collegechemistrystudent said:
I'm really bothered more people are not arguing with me on this. Does that mean people agree, and will stop belittling Nizoral?
it's because we know you like to have an attention whoring post every day where you post replies to yourself 10x in a raw, this is not an exception

Tell it how it is man, don't hold back or anything will ya :lol:
 
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