How To Live A Happy Life As An Unattractive Man?

[Rudiger]

This thread is going darker,

Why whatever do you mean?

You can't live a happy life.
As you flownder in this sh*t more and more, you slowly lose the ability to feel. You don't even try anymore, you just work - sh*t - eat - sleep like it's some sort of a ritual.
As an unattractive male, this life seems like a quicksand. You wonder how deep can this go on.

Oh

 

[Saulus]

I dunno but i see very old people who very happy even though they are old, ugly and have health problems

Or children with cancers who can still smile

I think its more related to brain chemistry really than to looks

I mean there was this study with lottery winners and after a few years they went back to the baseline hapiness they had before

 

[razzmatazz91]

Real cosmetic surgery involves changing your phenotype which is almost entirely based on your genes. I know it brings happiness because I've seen patients no longer have anxiety/depression when that one nagging issue is corrected so it does work. Then you get some people who are never satisfied and have multiple issues both mentally and physically - usually need psych help more than surgery. Surgery itself is generally limited too, can't make a massive transformation usually. IMO it's best for good looking people who have that one flaw which is ruining them - these people get the most out of surgery. So quality of life can improve markedly from cosmetic surgery despite the negative emotional and financial investment which can take a toll. There is always the risk of coming out looking unnatural when in the wrong hands too.

But other pertinent uncomfortable questions remain. Altering your appearance significantly, is that person really you when you look in the mirror? What about telling future gfs and when having a child? Your old friends and family? How does it feel to essentially be robocop and have nothing original? Will that bring happiness, being something artificial on a permanent basis? I see it as lying to the world and worse, to myself. I'd feel like a self hater. In b4 someone brings up make up which can be removed and is not the same thing.

I guess it's a question of comparing how you feel now to how you'd feel then - which one gives more happiness or less sadness. Still to me it seems like it's more a case of which is the lesser of the two evils. Not being good looking and looking presentable/good through surgery is a tough tough situation. I think what CF said about defining happiness and changing the way someone thinks is more important. I know I'm not in this situation but in that scenario, I'd think like that but we never know as it's hypothetical.

Deep stuff Wolf.
I also struggle with the idea of being a "liar". More so if I do what I am thinking about....getting an SMP. It seems to be an embarrassing issue.... Not only being found out, but the whole issue of how I could ever tell someone about it. Sure, I would love to get it and go live some of my youth.... But how would I break it to people who matter to me? Or the ones who will in future? I know for a fact no one will ever be able to understand my reasons for doing something like that... And that would open me to harsh judgement and emotional exclusion as a "faker" even from the few people who will be supportive.

I've spent days turning these questions in my mind.... And would welcome thoughts from all of you.

 

[Exodus2011]

I dunno but i see very old people who very happy even though they are old, ugly and have health problems

Or children with cancers who can still smile

I think its more related to brain chemistry really than to looks

I mean there was this study with lottery winners and after a few years they went back to the baseline hapiness they had before

a lot of very old people had what it takes to get old in the first place, which is basically having a happy stress free life aka BEING HOT. trust me, these people you're mentioning are most likely good looking for their age.

 

[IdealForehead]

Woah! I know it' hypothetical and an advert, but I'd divorce her too for not being honest. Honesty is the cornerstone of any healthy long term relationship. He would have been screwed over and so have his kids. If she would have been open about it, I'd respect that a lot but I'd struggle to be with her based on the amount of surgery she had. If I love someone, I like who they really are, flaws included and moderate adjustments if needed. Not a walking fake plastic look. Plus natural beauty = real beauty.

“The only thing you’ll ever have to worry about is how to explain it to the kids." Funny comment but frighteningly true.

Don't reproduce. Problem solved.

Also I have always told everyone I had jaw surgery if it's worth mentioning in conversation. When I have it again I'll tell people I've had it twice. I don't think it's anything to be ashamed of. People often find it interesting. I enjoy the shock value of explaining how they saw apart your face or showing an x-ray of all the screws in my face.

I will tell people too about my hairline surgery likely as well. No fucks given at all. I've never found mentioning jaw surgery has hurt how anyone sees me in any way. I don't see any reason to lie about it or conceal any of this stuff.

If I hadn't had my first jaw surgery I could not have lived as good a life as I have had. And although I didn't have a perfect outcome I'm happy I had it. I don't see a reason to pretend otherwise.

I dont consider my bad jaw alignment or bad hairline part of my fundamental identity. I consider them flaws to be corrected that have made my life considerably harder than if I didn't have them.

 

[JeanLucBB]

There is the cryptocurrency life, and and the normie life.

This chad vs incel paradigm is a mirage. Money > pussy. For most they can have both even if they look average.

Find other things you are good at, enjoy and can monetise and pursue them. Also get surgery with top doctors for whatever you can to looksmax to high heaven, eat well and work out.

 

[Exodus2011]

I disagree. I think money is boring once you have enough to live comfortably and the appeal of using it to buy women is very low.

Ambitious people will always want what they don't have. You already have women so that's less important to you. I already have enough money for me so that's less important to me.

I definitely hobby cope and I've been getting back into one of my bigger ones now that my hair is not stressing me out and its been fun.

I live in and grew up in poverty, having to forgo water , never having air conditioning or heat, and living on peanut butter sandwiches and i still cud give less of a f*** about money beyond enough to get hair transplant, technology copes, and survival

Just lol at caring about money

 

[IdealForehead]

Well like I mentioned, it's a case of which one brings more happiness. An artificial look or a natural but less attractive look. It's totally about what that person wants. In the plastic industry restorative work such as hair and skin is different to true cosmetic surgery. Hair transplant surgeons are passionate about explaining that.

I'm glad you're open about it and happy. Personally both options would suck for me in such a situation. Not having kids like you wrote, I can understand as it might make them suffer and they'd go down the same route you did.

My fundamental identity is my genetic make up and I'd never alter it.

Genetics have nothing to do with environmental stress or factors which contribute to how you look and develop too. And your genetics are only useful for reproduction. They are meaningless otherwise once you're dead and gone.

All that matters is what you can get out of your life before you die.

 

[IdealForehead]

Looks is all genetics, short of extreme environmental factors which can impede on the predetermined pattern. Genotypes for looks are strongly correlated for phenotype. Other than that, having awareness on clothes/hair style/behaviour is elementary.

Genetics does matter beyond reproducing. One of the most searched terms is to see how a celebrity looked before surgery. I hear it often enough with girls/boys when discussing looks "have they had work done or is it natural." I remember the outcry when one Miss Universe was found to have had considerable work done.

I don't mean to cause an argument with you, this is just how I see it. Like most people I put natural beauty in a different league to people who've changed their face considerably (obviously).

If your life is about getting the most of it before you die, you're on the right path. You'll get marked improvements from doing as much surgery as you can - quality of life will be greater significantly at least in theory. Of course I don't know your starting point and just speculating.

For me life is about loving myself which is completely related to accepting my looks, that's where I derive my peace from. Loving my family and close friends with many positive memories in between. I also like how I look like certain members of my extended family, again genetics. I'd take that over looking like something a plastic surgeon envisaged and learnt from books. I hate to **** on plastics since I've been involved in the field but this is my personal opinion, not professional!

As another example, I have balding genetics. However no one has ever seen me as obviously balding and I will die with a full head of thick hair at this point.

So which is more important? The fact that I have balding genetics? Or the fact that I will never actually go bald?

Environmental factors play a big role. For example adenoid overgrowth from allergies and not being corrected as a kid is one of the leading causes of needing jaw surgery later in life.

Daro is an environmental factor that is actively regrowing hair for me despite balding genetics.

It's easy for you to talk about "loving yourself as you are" because you've never actually been significantly limited or treated poorly in your life due to your looks. If you spent a life of it, you'd realize there's nothing fundamentally precious about your "natural" self and anything that reduces suffering and poor treatment in life will seem worth trying.

 

[Exodus2011]

I was about to type a response to this but I can't stop thinking that you're like a high-level Dante. Every post is consistently depressing and fatalistic, with no joy or hope in sight.

Honestly I think the fundamental tension in your life between what you want and are likely to get is essentially unsolvable.

Why do you have "laying down and rotting" in your regimen now? Lmfao

 

[RegenWaiting]

As another example, I have balding genetics. However no one has ever seen me as obviously balding and I will die with a full head of thick hair at this point.

So which is more important? The fact that I have balding genetics? Or the fact that I will never actually go bald?

Environmental factors play a big role. For example adenoid overgrowth from allergies and not being corrected as a kid is one of the leading causes of needing jaw surgery later in life.

Daro is an environmental factor that is actively regrowing hair for me despite balding genetics.

It's easy for you to talk about "loving yourself as you are" because you've never actually been significantly limited or treated poorly in your life due to your looks. If you spent a life of it, you'd realize there's nothing fundamentally precious about your "natural" self and anything that reduces suffering and poor treatment in life will seem worth trying.

One of the most serious environmental factors that inhibit aesthetics is the deformity of bone structure - rickets
It mostly affects legs, and the bigger part of the cases are refugees with darker skin living north.
This is directly correlated to Calcium (Ca2+) turnover in the human body and UBV light making cholestorol into vitD3.
The endocrine organ of thyroidea glandula is also in the mix with it's calsetonine, but plays a (relatively) small part.

So we know that too little sunlight (VERY relative - this is the point) causes inhibition of testosterone (jaw, sperm
production, potency, red blood cells etc etc), affects iron and calcium turnover, thyroid hormones, growth hormone
negative feedback...
Well in general tgis single very important factor tell us, you should live where your ancestry comes from. The situation
in the world today isn't exacty very permeable for a major part of the people to manage this.

Just my opinion,

Scary thing about it is - it's very little studied, and we're going to be witness to a lot more of it as a consequence
of heavy duty refugee wave coming in (wars, climate change).

In general, in medicine, still very little is known about just how much our genetic makeup is flexible and suitable
for heavy changes in it's living environment.

 

[IdealForehead]

I was about to type a response to this but I can't stop thinking that you're like a high-level Dante. Every post is consistently depressing and fatalistic, with no joy or hope in sight.

Honestly I think the fundamental tension in your life between what you want and are likely to get is essentially unsolvable.

You're a smart guy zircon. 100% accurate. The fact that I'm aware of that and know I'm damned and I will never have what I want just makes it worse.

Even if I fix my face sufficiently to look the way I feel I ought to (straight aligned jaws, normal hairline) I will be too old for it to really matter. And even if that wasn't the case I would feel unfulfilled based on never having a family which is something I always wanted as a kid.

I'm taking St. John's Wort now to see if I can medicate my way out of this thought pattern. I've taken ssris at the worse points of my life and they've helped temporarily.

Overall I still laugh and smile genuinely a lot through the day. I'm not completely joyless. But there is always this gnawing sense of unfulfillment due to the things I lack that I think may eat at me until the day I die.

I think it's a side effect of being overly ambitious. I've always been ambitious and a hard worker. I've never accepted poor outcomes. But when your ambition consistently exceeds your capacity the outcome will inevitably be disappointment.

 

[Exodus2011]

You're a smart guy zircon. 100% accurate. The fact that I'm aware of that and know I'm damned and I will never have what I want just makes it worse.

Even if I fix my face sufficiently to look the way I feel I ought to (straight aligned jaws, normal hairline) I will be too old for it to really matter. And even if that wasn't the case I would feel unfulfilled based on never having a family which is something I always wanted as a kid.

I'm taking St. John's Wort now to see if I can medicate my way out of this thought pattern. I've taken ssris at the worse points of my life and they've helped temporarily.

Overall I still laugh and smile genuinely a lot through the day. I'm not completely joyless. But there is always this gnawing sense of unfulfillment due to the things I lack that I think may eat at me until the day I die.

same here, maybe our aesthetic issues are equal considering the jaw thing, and me having a full norwood. at least i'm too mentally ill and aspie to have a (normal) girlfriend. i mainly just hate the idea of being seen as inferior by females and society, and the identity obliterating aspects of hair loss. the real killer is even if you "pull it off" you will ALWAYS be inferior to your past self, a lesser version of yourself.

i just cant wrap my head around how depressing that last f*****g part is.

 

[whatintheworld]

Many of my happiest moments in life have had nothing to do with my or anyone else's appearance.

Reuniting with my parents/relatives for the holidays, playing basketball with my friends, working on a really difficult problem during college and finally coming to a solution after so much painstaking work. Actually, reading some of my favorite books was so enjoyable that I was legitimately sad/depressed when I finished them.

Simply learning something new everyday brings me more enjoyment than I ever had in the company of a girl. That said, perhaps I just haven't met the right one yet.

 

[Exodus2011]

Many of my happiest moments in life have had nothing to do with my or anyone else's appearance.

Reuniting with my parents/relatives for the holidays, playing basketball with my friends, working on a really difficult problem during college and finally coming to a solution after so much painstaking work. Actually, reading some of my favorite books was so enjoyable that I was legitimately sad/depressed when I finished them.

Simply learning something new everyday brings me more enjoyment than I ever had in the company of a girl. That said, perhaps I just haven't met the right one yet.

thats true for me as well, but i need to walk around knowing i'm not an inferior old looking version of myself. its a feeling you always carry around, which is why it affects everything, just not directly.

for example i'm about to listen to this pop punk type song, and i'll enjoy it, but nowhere near as much as if i had hair, its just f*****g bizarre and weird and clashing as f*** remembering that i'm bald and listening to this teenage sounding music. it has important, even defining, associations with being young and hot and good hair. the genre is loaded with lyrics that only young people could relate to

 

[Exodus2011]

Over the years, as I've grown older, I've come to see the value of accepting aspects about your life that you cannot affect or overcome to any meaningful degree. Also the inherent value of being in a state of contentment. As a guy I knew once told me, "if you're happy, you win".

I'm not saying you should settle for the first fat single mom that comes along, just that there may be real value in examining your thought process and the way you subjectively evaluate the social goods you are struggling to acquire. There may be, and probably is, someone out there whose objective value is not super-high but who you get a sense of contentment through being with, and that someone is your best bet if you don't want to go the LDAR route and spend your remaining days drinking and posting on forums like this.

yea but like baldness is soooooo fundamentally different to other problems cuz we become a clearly obviously visibly inferior versions of our past selves.

this reminds me of my days feeling bad about my height when i went on bodybuilding misc, i didn't even think of myself as that short (5'6) but apparently it was "kill yourself" height on the misc. i got over it pretty easy considering i always had it, unlike with baldness. a lot easier to accept when you don't know anything else

 

[CaptainForehead]

I've taken ssris at the worse points of my life and they've helped temporarily.

How did you get ssris without seeing a therapist?

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

How did you get ssris without seeing a therapist?

GPs can give them out.

 

[CaptainForehead]

GPs can give them out.

Woa, did not expect that.

 

[Exodus2011]

There is some truth to that, but I'd argue that when the baldness is a fact and/or there are no accessible ways to mitigate it then accepting it and the resulting life quality is a viable way of tackling it mentally.

Yea ofc but just pointing out why its 10x harder to do that with baldness than with other things

Even accidents arent genetic , so its not comparable

Its the ultinate in being a has-been. So horribly depressing lol