Anyone been told their donor density is too low?

[jd_uk]

Went to see Dr ******** recently for a chat about a future transplant. I have thinning in the temples and crown but look like i have a fair amount of hair still. My hair type is very fine though and he said i had miniaturisation all over (lots of 1's and 2's as he called it) including in the donor area (measured in two places at 60 per cm2 and 70 per cm2). This made me wonder if i will be bald all over or if my donor density is naturally low. I dont think i have DUPA as like i say the temples and crown are worse.

Bottom line was that he didnt think i would be suitable for a transplant in future so medication would be my only option to keep my hair. Well minoxidil never worked for me and i just dont want to take finasteride for my whole life so i guess i am screwed.

 

[big_head]

Try finasteride now. You can decide to get off of it any time.

Don't wait. Worse case is that you try it, quit, and move on. It's just a pill, man.

 

[jd_uk]

Try finasteride now. You can decide to get off of it any time.

Don't wait. Worse case is that you try it, quit, and move on. It's just a pill, man.

It's just a pill that reduces my male sex hormones which are supposed to be there...

I want to keep my hair of course..but i have so many reasons why i don't want to take finasteride.

One of the main ones is never knowing how much good it is doing... my hair hasn't become much worse in 5 years despite being told i am miniaturising all over. There is bound to be a point in my life where i would want or need to come off it ...e.g. to have kids...to check if my sex drive has lowered through age or through use of the drug etc etc. I feel that the catch up hair loss in coming off it wouldnbe more traumatic for me than losing my hair gradually in a way which i and everyone around me gets used to. I just feel like it is not a healthy or a viable option. A hair transplant would have been permanent but alas it sounds like it is not to be.

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One suggest i was informed of were alternatives such as saw palmetto or keratene retard because they believed that these lowered DHT but more like to 30% and not to the 70% which finasteride does. That is something i MAY consider.

I'm athletic...i like to keep in shape and train competitively. finasteride also increases estrogen which is why some people get gyno and put on fat. Again ...i would never know if fat gain was from age or from the hormonal changes. That would bother me and i don't believe it healthy.

Sucks that in 2016 all we have for hair loss is minoxidil and finasteride.

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Btw...i notice that your regime is nizoral ×2 per week. This is something i do use. How does it help for you?

 

[shookwun]

wear a hair piece.

 

[Hairloss23]

Sorry but at the moment at least it is finasteride or no hair. I wish it was otherwise and I genuinely mean that. I don't like taking my dutasteride, I don't think anyone does except maybe Agustin. But it is all we have because no one cares about hair loss.

EDIT: Thank you for neg repping me Notcoolanymore, as well as not providing a given reason for doing so. I can't help but think this is your response to my arguments in another thread. And this is your way of somehow getting back at me as you could not argue my points. What a sad and pathetic thing to do, your what? 40? And you still shove your fingers in your ears and hide when you can't handle what someone is telling you, Only to come back and take stabs at them for no reason. Pathetic. Usually I would never call out someone for a repping on a comment as it is not a moral thing to do (unlike you who does it whenever because you have no morals). But I did so on this occasion because your neg rep had no meaning behind it other than to stroke your own ego. Your a grown man for goodness sake. Grow a pair.

 

[big_head]

It's just a pill that reduces my male sex hormones which are supposed to be there...

I want to keep my hair of course..but i have so many reasons why i don't want to take finasteride.

I thought exactly like you 3 years ago.

My hairline is more receded and I have lost a ton of density. All I can think about is how I could have filled in my hairline and maintained my thick hair if only I started 3 years ago.

Now, it may be too late for me. Even if it isn't, I will never get what I could have gotten.

People told me the same thing 3 years ago when I was in your position and I scoffed at their insistence to take a drug that would "mess with my male hormones".

I understand now why they said what they said.

You will try all the treatments- minoxidil, saw palmetto, nizoral, dermarollers, scakp massages, banging your head against the wall, handstands, biotin, whatever. Some of them will stave off the hairloss but none will stop it like finasteride.

And what will happen is you will eventually cave out of desperation and try finasteride 3-4 years later and at that point you will be fighting an uphill battle.

I'm really not trying to be dramatic here. Many others will back me up in what I am saying- if you truly want to keep your hair, you're going to try finasteride at some point. Trying it later will provide you with no benefits and only deep, sincere regret.

Btw...i notice that your regime is nizoral ×2 per week. This is something i do use. How does it help for you?

My hair is thinner than ever. Really bummed. I have no clue if it's the male pattern baldness suddenly crossing the line and I didn't notice, or it could be a combination of a nizoral/minoxidil shed. I quit minoxidil back in october because it didn't seem to do anything for me and I think it caused a shed....it very well could have helped me maintain, but I wanted to quit it before I start finasteride. Believe it or not, I have been putting off ordering finasteride because I'm so depressed that I feel like it won't save my hair at this point. Please don't become me. I know you're worried about finasteride, but there will be a point where you'll look in the mirror and feel absolute horror and confusion and a total loss of control, and suddenly all the sides in the world won't matter.

If you get sides from finasteride- legit sides- just quit. Permanent sides only happen in like .5% of patients, and those were the guys that kept taking it for months despite the sides. If you feel that worried, ask people on this forum.

Bottom line: if you ever think you will try finasteride, just try it now. Don't wait. if you are positive the risk is never going to be worth it, I suggest you start shaving your head now and accept it. Don't fool yourself because you will watch your hair slowly die over the years and it will be way worse than you can even imagine.

 

[shookwun]

^ This man speaks the truth.

 

[jd_uk]

I thought exactly like you 3 years ago.

My hairline is more receded and I have lost a ton of density. All I can think about is how I could have filled in my hairline and maintained my thick hair if only I started 3 years ago.

Now, it may be too late for me. Even if it isn't, I will never get what I could have gotten.

People told me the same thing 3 years ago when I was in your position and I scoffed at their insistence to take a drug that would "mess with my male hormones".

I understand now why they said what they said.

You will try all the treatments- minoxidil, saw palmetto, nizoral, dermarollers, scakp massages, banging your head against the wall, handstands, biotin, whatever. Some of them will stave off the hairloss but none will stop it like finasteride.

And what will happen is you will eventually cave out of desperation and try finasteride 3-4 years later and at that point you will be fighting an uphill battle.

I'm really not trying to be dramatic here. Many others will back me up in what I am saying- if you truly want to keep your hair, you're going to try finasteride at some point. Trying it later will provide you with no benefits and only deep, sincere regret.



My hair is thinner than ever. Really bummed. I have no clue if it's the male pattern baldness suddenly crossing the line and I didn't notice, or it could be a combination of a nizoral/minoxidil shed. I quit minoxidil back in october because it didn't seem to do anything for me and I think it caused a shed....it very well could have helped me maintain, but I wanted to quit it before I start finasteride. Believe it or not, I have been putting off ordering finasteride because I'm so depressed that I feel like it won't save my hair at this point. Please don't become me. I know you're worried about finasteride, but there will be a point where you'll look in the mirror and feel absolute horror and confusion and a total loss of control, and suddenly all the sides in the world won't matter.

If you get sides from finasteride- legit sides- just quit. Permanent sides only happen in like .5% of patients, and those were the guys that kept taking it for months despite the sides. If you feel that worried, ask people on this forum.

Bottom line: if you ever think you will try finasteride, just try it now. Don't wait. if you are positive the risk is never going to be worth it, I suggest you start shaving your head now and accept it. Don't fool yourself because you will watch your hair slowly die over the years and it will be way worse than you can even imagine.

I appreciate your response, genuinely... because i can tell you are a decent guy who is trying to help. Believe me i have spemt years flip flopping over the decision over whether to take finasteride. I have already had those desperate moments and i have probably now started to have more people comment on the balding spot at the back of my head. But for some reason..i just cant take it. I keep my hair very short...not quite a grade 4 but a trim as short as the barber can go...and this in itself gets me comments from people 'why do you cut it so short...looks better longer etc'. I believe that the thin spots also show more when i have ny hair short but it is just my way of preparing myself for the inevitable and having other people get used to me as a guy with not much hair. Right now i have days where i feel ok and have a 'f*ck it' attitude and then i have days where i just crash and get quite depressed and obsessive about it. Today has been another one of those days. Really i have to keep reminding myself that baldness is actually quite a normal thing for men and there are plenty of guys out there who live pretty good lives despite it and it doesnt bother them too much. That is the sort of person i want to become and i know it will be very tough for me to do. In a way i feel like maybe taking finasteride might even jut prolong the lain because while i am trying to hold on to something i am always going to obsess about it...and it is common knowledge that eventually genetics will win over finasteride even.

I'm not going to say never...but i if there is any way that i can not take a hormone altering drug (even if that means losing my hair) then i want to try it. I've been lucky in a sense so far in that my hair loss has been slow...although if it is miniaturised all over then i know it is probably not long before things get pretty bad.

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wear a hair piece.

Respect to people who do but its not something i can consider. For a start i wouldnt want/be able to take the cr*p i would get about it from people who know me.

 

[Pequod]

If you are down to 1's and 2's in the donor area that is not how you were born. DHT has reduced it to 1's and 2's and there is only one thing to alter that.

 

[jd_uk]

If you are down to 1's and 2's in the donor area that is not how you were born. DHT has reduced it to 1's and 2's and there is only one thing to alter that.

But isn't the donor area supposed to be permanent? And looking at photos of my hair...there is no apparent visible change to the donor area in ...well at least 6 years..probably more... i've always had fine, slightly see through hair.

I mean...even my dad who is a NW6 has his donor area.

 

[shookwun]

It's not permanent. Donor area is susceptible to thinning, even more so with those who have DUPA/DPA hair characteristics.


However, these zones are very much so DHT resistant with the aid of finasteride.


If you have a extensive history of aggressive Androgenetic Alopecia/male pattern baldness within the family and aren't willing to take finasteride, then you are not a good candidate for hair restoration.


As I mentioned earlier a 1) hair piece 2) Finasteride with hair transplant 3) bald are your options.



Could potentially get transplants to add more density to the whole head, and not be on finasteride but you will have to accept it will be a low yeild, and more or less just provide you with the image of having hair on your head. As your native hair will continue to thin, and bald.

 

[jd_uk]

It's not permanent. Donor area is susceptible to thinning, even more so with those who have DUPA/DPA hair characteristics.


However, these zones are very much so DHT resistant with the aid of finasteride.


If you have a extensive history of aggressive Androgenetic Alopecia/male pattern baldness within the family and aren't willing to take finasteride, then you are not a good candidate for hair restoration.


As I mentioned earlier a 1) hair piece 2) Finasteride with hair transplant 3) bald are your options.



Could potentially get transplants to add more density to the whole head, and not be on finasteride but you will have to accept it will be a low yeild, and more or less just provide you with the image of having hair on your head. As your native hair will continue to thin, and bald.

I was told that because my hair is very fine and the de sity is not good then a hair transplant would never be a good idea as could causd shock loss in the donor area...he seemed to suggest that would be the case even if i took finasteride because of my naturally fine hair. My grandad (maternal) was around a NW4v in his later years...my dad went to a NW6 by 40. Maybe i'll get my grandads type of hair loss...maybe my dads or a mix of both.

The hard thing for me to rationalise is that it has been so slow. I first noticed a receding hairline in 2009 and i still have friends who think im talking nonsense when i tell them i am going bald.

 

[marco75]

Went to see Dr ******** recently for a chat about a future transplant. I have thinning in the temples and crown but look like i have a fair amount of hair still. My hair type is very fine though and he said i had miniaturisation all over (lots of 1's and 2's as he called it) including in the donor area (measured in two places at 60 per cm2 and 70 per cm2). This made me wonder if i will be bald all over or if my donor density is naturally low. I dont think i have DUPA as like i say the temples and crown are worse.

Bottom line was that he didnt think i would be suitable for a transplant in future so medication would be my only option to keep my hair. Well minoxidil never worked for me and i just dont want to take finasteride for my whole life so i guess i am screwed.

I had similar fro Dr B. I had 60, 100 and 60 cm2. I have been on the big three since (5 months) then and it has thickened up all over, will wait till a year then go to a few others for opinions. Will be happy with a Norwood 2-3 as Im 40.

 

[jd_uk]

I had similar fro Dr B. I had 60, 100 and 60 cm2. I have been on the big three since (5 months) then and it has thickened up all over, will wait till a year then go to a few others for opinions. Will be happy with a Norwood 2-3 as Im 40.

Were those numbers in your donot are? What is your current Norwood?

They actually marked me down as a NW1 even though that is clearly not the case and i have thinning probably in a NW2-3v area. Maybe they just meant i had some hair in the nw1 region still (again i dont think this is the case).

Did/do you have any worries about finasteride for the rest of your life? Have you noticed any adverse effects?

 

[marco75]

Were those numbers in your donot are? What is your current Norwood?

They actually marked me down as a NW1 even though that is clearly not the case and i have thinning probably in a NW2-3v area. Maybe they just meant i had some hair in the nw1 region still (again i dont think this is the case).

Did/do you have any worries about finasteride for the rest of your life? Have you noticed any adverse effects?

Donor area yes, I would say I am a Norwood 5-6 still have hair all over scalp but its thin still but meds helping. If I continue to get regrowth for a year then should be a matter of FUE to add a (mature) hairline and thicken scalp so it look fairly even all over, will still buzz it though as it won't be dense enough to grow long. Thats the hope anyway might not be possible but its worth a shot.

Slight adverse effects but nothing to worry about. I would rather have some hair and have a chance if technology improves so staying on finasteride till I die.

 

[jd_uk]

Donor area yes, I would say I am a Norwood 5-6 still have hair all over scalp but its thin still but meds helping. If I continue to get regrowth for a year then should be a matter of FUE to add a (mature) hairline and thicken scalp so it look fairly even all over, will still buzz it though as it won't be dense enough to grow long. Thats the hope anyway might not be possible but its worth a shot.

Slight adverse effects but nothing to worry about. I would rather have some hair and have a chance if technology improves so staying on finasteride till I die.

What sort of adverse effects if you don't mind me asking?

See i'm just one of these people that doesnt believe the 2% claims... i feel like if you are removing a powerful sex hormone that is there for a natural reason, there will always be an effect. Hey maybe one of the intended effects is to make certain men go bald too and its just a shame that for us at this point in time, society deems it to be a negative thing rather than a positive one.

 

[shookwun]

common side effect a lot of men experience is watery semen at first, but for most the body adjusts, and balances back to a base line.


This is the only side effect I noticed.

 

[marco75]

What sort of adverse effects if you don't mind me asking?

See i'm just one of these people that doesnt believe the 2% claims... i feel like if you are removing a powerful sex hormone that is there for a natural reason, there will always be an effect. Hey maybe one of the intended effects is to make certain men go bald too and its just a shame that for us at this point in time, society deems it to be a negative thing rather than a positive one.

It can take me a few seconds more to get wood, but they become less and less as time goes on.

 

[jd_uk]

common side effect a lot of men experience is watery semen at first, but for most the body adjusts, and balances back to a base line.


This is the only side effect I noticed.

Did you ever have concerns about fertility or was that not an issue for you? I've read some studies which claimed finasteride did lower fertility somewhat which concerned me. I know that probably plenty of peopl have had no issues with that but it just again seems like a bit of a risk.

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It can take me a few seconds more to get wood, but they become less and less as time goes on.

Again...at the risk of too much information...being single i have to use condoms with girls...i really hate using them and ocassionally struggle to get/stay that hard with them (have no issues without). I really wouldn't be keen on adding to that.

 

[Rockinlove]

Not a candidate for a hair transplant?

I am a diffuse thinner (DUPA - with thinning on sides) and have been on generic finasteride for the past three years. Longer on minoxidil and nizoral and it has helped me maintain baseline with some thickening.

Switched to generic dutasteride recently (3 months) and have noticed a lot of shedding. Started with 3 times a week to every day this month(JAN) and the shedding has increased drastically.

Intend to continue for a 4 more months and then assess results. Also contemplating ditching minoxidil because I am not sure if it is helping.

Wondering if a dense packing hair transplant is the answer since I have a lot of body hair.