Aromasin fixed all my side effects...but...

[Rayan27]

Have been using finasteride for about 5 months, after 2 months or so my hairloss stopped completely and my head stopped itching. Last 2 months I have noticed a decrease in in libido as indicated by my gf (from 3 times a week sex to once or so, almost stopped masturbating too, my erections are fine though) I have also been more depressed which is coupled with fatigue...

Now I have to say before I started finasteride I did a blood check which came out at low testosterone (325-350ng/dl at 26 year old) reference range is somewhere between 350-900.

I started using Aromasin for about 3 weeks now in conjunction with my normal finasteride dosage (0.25mg three times a week) and holy hell what a difference....fatigue is gone, less depressed, during the day i suddenly feel surges of hornyness coming out of nowhere, sex with my girl is much better.

Downside is...I have started shedding again...like massively shedding. I run my hands through my hair about 4-5 times a day and every time about 10-15 hairs come along with it. May i remind you, during the finasteride nothing came loose, maybe a single strand. My question is, what is causing the low libido? Is it the nocebo/psychosomatic effect or could the finasteride actually be causing my low libido.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

Finasteride increases both estrogen and testosterone.

Aromasin decreases estrogen and increases testosterone.

By using both, you probably have less estrogen, more testosterone, and less dihydrotestosterone than when you started. The finasteride should still be decreasing DHT, but not by as much as it would if you were not on the aromasin.

 

[Rayan27]

Finasteride increases both estrogen and testosterone.

Aromasin decreases estrogen and increases testosterone.

By using both, you probably have less estrogen, more testosterone, and less dihydrotestosterone than when you started. The finasteride should still be decreasing DHT, but not by as much as it would if you were not on the aromasin.

You seem like someone knowledgeable, so what you are saying is that when I started using Aromasin next to the finasteride I have probably increased my testosterone, and decreased my DHT, even more so then when I wasn't using anything at all? So if I would stop everything right now, I would go back to the state where my DHT levels are higher then they are now?

This is all so complicated with the feedback loops, what if I start using 1mg everyday as opposed to .25 three times a week...would that decrease my DHT even further and maybe so stop the shedding I am having right now? Thank you for answering these questions by the way, I really appreciate it:lost:

 

[nate30]

Rayan are you working with an endo, or getting routine blood tests? I don't think it's a great idea to plan to use Aromasin indefinitely. Bodybuilders use it on cycle or as post cycle therapy to prevent aromatization of the exogenous Test to Estrogen, but the key word here is "cycle". As you say the body has many feedback loops that frankly are still not all that well understood by medicine.

Testosterone is thought to be implicated to some extent in hairloss (but to a lesser degree than DHT), so yes the rise in T may be causing increased shedding. But the bigger issue here than hair loss is that suppressing Estrogen levels indefinitely isn't likely to be healthy. You should at least have a competent endo monitoring your situation. Ultimately if you feel Finasteride is impacting your sex life in an unacceptable way, you need to consider dropping it. Attempting to address the side effects of one drug with other drugs usually leads to even more problems, especially when it comes to hormones.

 

[Dench57]

Might be worth getting your estrogen levels checked. If your sides improve with Aromasin, it means these sides were quite likely caused by high estrogen.

AIs are bad for hair. They boost T (bad for hair) and decrease aromatase/estrogen (good for hair).

I'd consider trying a less harsh AI like Arimidex, and trying to find the right balance between sides and hair. Using any AI, especially one as strong as Aromasin, for prolonged periods, will bring its own problems.

 

[Rayan27]

Rayan are you working with an endo, or getting routine blood tests? I don't think it's a great idea to plan to use Aromasin indefinitely. Bodybuilders use it on cycle or as post cycle therapy to prevent aromatization of the endogenous Test to Estrogen, but the key word here is "cycle". As you say the body has many feedback loops that frankly are still not all that well understood by medicine.

Testosterone is thought to be implicated to some extent in hairloss (but to a lesser degree than DHT), so yes the rise in T may be causing increased shedding. But the bigger issue here than hair loss is that suppressing Estrogen levels indefinitely isn't likely to be healthy. You should at least have a competent endo monitoring your situation. Ultimately if you feel Finasteride is impacting your sex life in an unacceptable way, you need to consider dropping it. Attempting to address the side effects of one drug with other drugs usually leads to even more problems, especially when it comes to hormones.

I have done a bloodtest before where my T came back low and my estrogen above average (although within reference range). There are a ton of people using an AI indefinitely who are on TRT, doing the exact same thing, offsetting the effects of one drug with another. Their dosage usually ranges from 5 to 25mg a day. I am not even near any of those dosages, a micro dose of 1.25mg twice a week...how bad can it be? I havent felt this not depressed/not fatigued in a long time. All I want is to not be fatigued so much and be able to perform 2-3 a week sexually, that too much to ask

We report the first detailed study of the pharmacological effects of exemestane in male subjects. Doses of 25 and 50 mg were comparable in suppressing all circulating estrogens and had similar effects of increasing serum androstenedione and testosterone concentrations. There were 38%, 71%, and 45% decreases in estradiol, estrone, and estrone sulfate concentrations, respectively, after 10 d, approximately 24 h after administration of the last dose of 25 mg exemestane, coupled with 60% and 32% increases in testosterone and androstenedione concentrations. The rise in the aromatase substrates, testosterone and androstenedione, is probably secondary to substrate accumulation and/or to the feedback increase in gonadotropins caused by aromatase blockade. The 21% decrease in SHBG concentrations caused by 25 mg exemestane confirms the observation in postmenopausal women (20). - See more at: http://press.endocrine.org/doi/full/10.1210/jc.2003-031279#sthash.qPHaZNrl.dpuf

 

[nate30]

It's not too much to ask, but in the end some men have to choose between hair or dick, to put it bluntly. The difference between you and the guys on TRT is that they're being continually monitored by a doctor, and even they can run into issues long term. In my opinion it's not a great idea for you to self medicate like this (if that is indeed the case), even taking micro doses. And no I don't think upping the Finasteride dose would have much of an impact either way.

 

[Rayan27]

It's not too much to ask, but in the end some men have to choose between hair or dick, to put it bluntly. The difference between you and the guys on TRT is that they're being continually monitored by a doctor, and even they can run into issues long term. In my opinion it's not a great idea for you to self medicate like this (if that is indeed the case), even taking micro doses. And no I don't think upping the Finasteride dose would have much of an impact either way.

This is a really harsh choice, I grew up being severely bullied because of my oddly skull shape, up to the point that I became suicidal. I grew my hair long and am regarded as handsome as an adult and dealt with most of my issues. I cannot imagine going bald and back to my weird skull shape and everything that came with it.

I will contact my doctor to have some bloodtest ordered so he can keep track of my values then

 

[Bagels]

Hey @Rayan27 have you any updates on your hair and side effects? I've had major finasteride sides before but want to go back and do AI to keep sides at bay.

 

[lukedorian]

Have been using finasteride for about 5 months, after 2 months or so my hairloss stopped completely and my head stopped itching. Last 2 months I have noticed a decrease in in libido as indicated by my gf (from 3 times a week sex to once or so, almost stopped masturbating too, my erections are fine though) I have also been more depressed which is coupled with fatigue...

Now I have to say before I started finasteride I did a blood check which came out at low testosterone (325-350ng/dl at 26 year old) reference range is somewhere between 350-900.

I started using Aromasin for about 3 weeks now in conjunction with my normal finasteride dosage (0.25mg three times a week) and holy hell what a difference....fatigue is gone, less depressed, during the day i suddenly feel surges of hornyness coming out of nowhere, sex with my girl is much better.

Downside is...I have started shedding again...like massively shedding. I run my hands through my hair about 4-5 times a day and every time about 10-15 hairs come along with it. May i remind you, during the finasteride nothing came loose, maybe a single strand. My question is, what is causing the low libido? Is it the nocebo/psychosomatic effect or could the finasteride actually be causing my low libido.

I experience the same thing while on Arimidex, but i can control it by reducing the dose, testosterone is also very low, we don´t have aromasin in my country (spain) i use arimidex at a very low dose 0.5 mg thursdat and 0.25 mg on mondays, also has low t, that is why i also added clomid 12.5 eod
0.25 mg of propecia 3 times a week is too low for antiestrigen use, by using antiestrogens you should up the propecia dose.

 

[lukedorian]

It's not too much to ask, but in the end some men have to choose between hair or dick, to put it bluntly. The difference between you and the guys on TRT is that they're being continually monitored by a doctor, and even they can run into issues long term. In my opinion it's not a great idea for you to self medicate like this (if that is indeed the case), even taking micro doses. And no I don't think upping the Finasteride dose would have much of an impact either way.

No, there are ways to try to combat propecia side effects, some of us with some medical training can make it happen by experiecing with our selves
If low t while on propecia means very low DHT, if that is the case, clomid is needed and a AI, thing is at what dose since every individual is different. but that is the way to go.

1 month 25 mg of proviron total testosterone 394, E2 36 (propecia eod)
1 month clomid 25 mg eod and proviron 25 mg ed total testosterone 454, E2 40 (estrogen needs to be managed) (propecia eod)
Starting Arimidex 0.5 mg thursday and 0.25 mg monday + Clomid 12.5 mg eod + proviron 12.5 ed (propecia eod) i will post results after a month of this treatment, few days into this treatment and i´m feeling great, hair looks also good mild shed.

 

[lukedorian]

Finasteride increases both estrogen and testosterone.

Aromasin decreases estrogen and increases testosterone.

By using both, you probably have less estrogen, more testosterone, and less dihydrotestosterone than when you started. The finasteride should still be decreasing DHT, but not by as much as it would if you were not on the aromasin.

Yes but he already said his testosterone levels are low 390, so using aromasin only will make his testosterone go up, clomid will, but since i don´t know aromasin i can´t recomend dose for it.
i also overused clomid and arimidex and the result was E2 levels < 10 very counter productive for libido and body composition and mood, thing with clomid is it has Zuclomiphene that is E2 molecule like and Enclomiphene that is androgen like to stimulate FSH and LH production, if used not correctly the E2 caused by Zuclomiphene can not be supressed by antiestrogen.
You need to find a sweet spot for the dosage but that is the way to go, also if DHT by propecia is oversupressed a low dose of proviron will do fine

 

[Bagels]

Recently started a trial of finasteride/AI as well. Try Arimidex its less harsh and at a lower dose .25 mg 3x week max. Less if you can tolerate it. Could also look into topical estriol cream to protect hair from lowered estrogen.

Last case, you could be very aggressive and try dutasteride to really protect follicles. This only works if your hair is not testosterone sensitive b/c it will go thru the roof with dutasteride/AI combo. RU is also an option