Bryan's chart...

[Bryan]

What was the experiment? I just _love_ experiments!

 

[stax]

Oh man, its really really complicated.


Ive been holding water or something in my cheeks since about May, non fat related, ive always been lean and muscular, but i crashed off stimulants and messed up my adrenals, at the same time i was a lot more stress prone from using Dutasteride.


So for a while i thought the puffyness was from low DHT, but i tried Dutasteride again with 2.5mg Letrozole, and 50mcg T3 ( not the best for adrenals i know ), and was peeing a lot for the first 2 days and my face looked 90% normal again after 2 days on this, but the puffyness came back after i popped my tird doese of T3 on the third monring, and even since stopping Dutasteride again it hasnt gone away.


Im trying to figure out what the hell is wrong with my system because ive never held water in my cheeks like this before and its a hormonal issue.



But the fact that i was able to lose the puffyness after 2 days on Avodart means my DHT was being lowered and i still lost the water.


Mabye initally the T3 makes me lose the puffyness, but shortly after it effects my adrenals glands and raised my cortisol.


Ive gotton blood tests,ect, they dont help much.


I dont know but this is some stupid complictaed crap!


I'll get to the bottom of it eventually.

 

[Dogs3]

stax, to make sure, are you saying that the dutasteride did not cause the puffiness?

 

[Dogs3]

also, i wanted to add that i took a fat burner pill for like 8 months about a year and a half ago to help boost energy and lose like a few pounds. It was called lipovarin, i think its just a ton of caffine, but i stopped cold turkey about a year ago. Could this give a rebound effect similar to yours or is this kind of suppliment too weak?

 

[stax]

Honestly bro i shouldnt have messed around with stims but the damn Dutasteride was giving me fatigue so i wanted to try and stay on it.


The dutasteride DID cause me puffyness in the past and after 3 weeks of quitting and using AIMF which is an aromatase inhibitor it went away.


Then the adrenal issue from crashing off stims puffed my face up which is common in adrenal faigue due to a cortisol issue i think and/or Aldosterone imbalance/electrolyte imbalance. Its complicated.


But just read what i said regariding what i tried and the puffyness.


You can crash off of stims if your prone so taper off and be carefull. If it didnt happen pretty much within 1-2 weeks then you should be fine.


My serious advice to your bro, DONT use Avodart. Stick with finasteride and if anything move on to Proscar but you havent even been on finasteride for a year man. Slow down use the finasteride and enjoy your life bro.

 

[Dogs3]

yeah i think maybe ill jus stick with propecia for anaother few months and see. I just stopped minoxidil though because it was giving me excess facial hair and some scalp problems too, i might just reduce the dose though maybe just apply a bit to the temples which it really where i need it anyway. But since stopping minoxidil i want something to give me an edge so ive been thinking about dutasteride. It sucks when you have to cut something out of your regimen because the minoxidil seemed to be working and it was only around a month and a half.

 

[stax]

Yeah i was in the same boat, i had to quit minoxidil aswell.


Thats the exaxt reason why i wanted to hop on dutasteride, but i havent been on anything for the past 6 months and when i grew my hair out it looked pretty decent, so i dont think ive lost any ground at all and overall the majority of my hairs are thicker, but i also have a adrenal or something issue going on that i think was helping my hair a bit.


I mean most guys have a bit of a receeding hairline, and when you grow your hair longer and style it you dont even notice it, and it looks good. I look soooo much better with longer hair.


Im definetly jumping back on Propecia or Proscar with AIMF or Letrozole, but i just quit T3 and it takes 2 weeks for your thyroid to return to normal, so i want to wait untill then. Plus i might lose some water aswell.


The reason i suggest Proscar first is because when you quit the sides should go away withint 3 weeks and the halflife is only 8 hours or so i think? DHT returns to normal usually in about 3 weeks.



With dutasteride the longer you use it the more i builds up in your system and it can lower your DHT levels for 6-12 months or more after you quit in some cases. If you get sides your f**ked.


Take my advice and dont touch it. You NEED to give finasteride a year to see if its working for you, if you havent lost any hair your good and at year 2 you can have even better results.



You have only been on it for 6 months? Please man thats nothing. If you dont have patience and jump on dutasteride and get sides dont say i didnt warn you.


If you want to add something try Prox-N, it should help you out combined with finasteride.


Thats what i just started, Prox-N. It has spin traps in it aswell Dr.P said.


Its almost like water, clean and clear colour, dries in a minute with absolutely no residue of any kind.


I wish they made it in a foam version so its easier to apply to long hair.

 

[Dogs3]

its funny you mention that because i just got a bottle of prox-n from the LEF website today... So are there no sides with it similar to minoxidil..ie: water retention puffyness, increased facial hair growth?
(i know there may be scalp irritation but i dont really care about that).

And do you think we can see some decent results comparatively to minoxidil with this stuff and finasteride?

 

[CCS]

no side effects for me, though minoxidil did not give me side effects either.

 

[Antoitoine]

Hi Bryan

What is with Topic Finasterid?
here a Report

1997 JOURNAL Of DERMATOLOGICAL TREATMENT 8(3):189-192
mazzarella f; Loconsole f; Cammisa A; Mastrolonardo M; Vena GA
Topical finasteride in the treatment of androgenic alopecia. Preliminary evaluations after a 16-month therapy course

Topical fINASTERIDE has potential in the treatment of androgenic alopecia, report researchers from Italy. In this pilot study, 52 patients (28 men) with androgenic alopecia applied a topical finasteride 0.005% solution (n=26), or vehicle (26), twice daily for 16 months. Journal of Dermatological Treatment 8: 189-192, Sep 1997

Mazzarella Report


They used a typical vehicle of 50% ethanol, 25% propylene glycol, and 25% water. The results were measured (in part) by taking monthly photographs, and then comparing the photos at the end of the 16-month trial. The photos were graded on the following scale:

5 Complete restoration of hair density
4 Marked reduction of balding area(s)
3 Slight reduction of balding area(s)
2 No change compared to baseline
1 Slight enlargement of balding area(s)
0 Marked enlargement of balding area(s)

Here is the paragraph from their "Evaluation of hair regrowth" section:

"During the first 3 months of the trial, the clinical response was not significant. The scores for hair regrowth ranged from 1 to 2 with no significant difference between the two study groups. By contrast, throughout the subsequent course of the study a significant improvement in the status of the scalp hair was observed among the finasteride-treated patients. At the end of the study, the clinical results were scored 4 in 12 patients and 3 in the remaining 14. Response to treatment was substantiated by both an increase in the hair density at the periphery of balding areas and a progressive, though slow and incomplete retrieval of the hair texture within previously bare sites. Patients initially grew vellus-type hair that tended to change to thicker, pigmented terminal hair as the clinical response progressed. As for the group receiving placebo, only ten patients were evaluable at the end of the study. The high number of dropouts was a result of the lack of any improvement in the status of the scalp hair. These results were scored as follows: 2 in three patients, 1 in three patients and 0 in four patients."

"Of the 52 patients enrolled, 36 (69.2%) completed the entire study period. Notably, all dropouts occurred in the placebo group after 1 to 10 months. Moreover, the overall tolerability of the treatment was excellent. No patient experienced any local or systemic untoward effect. In particular, in the finasteride group laboratory data indicated revealed no relevant change in plasma levels of total testosterone, free testosterone or dihydrotestosterone. On the basis of these findings any significant percutaneous absorption of the drug could reasonably be excluded."

[/quote]


Timi, may I ask you WHERE you found the text of this study?

 

[Antoitoine]

This study is a fake.

The original study leads to opposite conclusions.