Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[Father_of_Shiseido]

What I'm trying to say is it is a legit and one of the best treatments for cis-males who want to remain male and don't want to resort to estrogen.

A balding person has, in general, high testosterone, LH, DHEA, and prolactin. Whereas, the levels of FSH and SHBG are decreased.

Now spironolactone decreases T, LH, DHEA, and prolactin, as well as suppresses TGF-beta1, inflammation and fibrosis - all these factors have been found to be contributing to Androgenic Alopecia.

Spironolactone doesn't decrease testosterone.

 

[LEXUS]

it does not matter whether he lowers testosterone or not. it reduces dht androstenedione and androsterone, which are also converted into dht. and most importantly, hair grows from spironolactone. but there are side effects. I don’t even care how spironolactone works. the main thing is that it works. To completely suppress dht, you need to take 10 tablets of avodart. but they can be reduced by adding spironolactone.

 

[itsyaboi]

Isn’t it the case that spironolactone loses effectiveness in time though? I’ve read threads of people that have used it that say they have needed to up its dose from 100 to 200 to 400 and who knows in a few more years they could be needing 1000+ mg of it daily just to maintain the gains. For this reason I don’t think it would be great in the long term as the chances of side effects build up?

 

[Father_of_Shiseido]

Isn’t it the case that spironolactone loses effectiveness in time though? I’ve read threads of people that have used it that say they have needed to up its dose from 100 to 200 to 400 and who knows in a few more years they could be needing 1000+ mg of it daily just to maintain the gains. For this reason I don’t think it would be great in the long term as the chances of side effects build up?

I believe that bicalutamide would be the best answer to male pattern baldness considering you wish to remain men.

 

[I'mme]

it does not matter whether he lowers testosterone or not. it reduces dht androstenedione and androsterone, which are also converted into dht. and most importantly, hair grows from spironolactone. but there are side effects. I don’t even care how spironolactone works. the main thing is that it works. To completely suppress dht, you need to take 10 tablets of avodart. but they can be reduced by adding spironolactone.

That's what most people don't know. They just think that Spironolactone is for blocking testosterone, but they don't realise it blocks/reduces DHT equally well. Moreover people are seriously undermining the role of prolactin, DHEA, TGF-beta1 etc.
These explanations are simply making me look like a cuck who can digest "rational criticisms" of the pill he is taking.

 

[I'mme]

I believe that bicalutamide would be the best answer to male pattern baldness considering you wish to remain men.

You can't take it for long if you're not adding anything that would reduce T and DHT, as both would go through roof due to negative feedback.

 

[I'mme]

Isn’t it the case that spironolactone loses effectiveness in time though? I’ve read threads of people that have used it that say they have needed to up its dose from 100 to 200 to 400 and who knows in a few more years they could be needing 1000+ mg of it daily just to maintain the gains. For this reason I don’t think it would be great in the long term as the chances of side effects build up?

I guess it was 4-5 years for Americanhairlines, 3years (Iirc) for quineapig but it still works for him just not that effectively. Others have still not come to this site to report anything so can't say about them.

I have seriously considered bicalutamide but I can't take it now. All the person on it are taking it with estrogen, except Maave. But then, Maave didn't have hairloss as aggressive as mine and had only temples receded. Moreover the regrowth he is seeing is in his own words, is terribly slow.

If I ever find a way to take bicalutamide without needing to take estrogen, I would instantaneously hop on it.

 

[I'mme]

Isn’t it the case that spironolactone loses effectiveness in time though? I’ve read threads of people that have used it that say they have needed to up its dose from 100 to 200 to 400 and who knows in a few more years they could be needing 1000+ mg of it daily just to maintain the gains. For this reason I don’t think it would be great in the long term as the chances of side effects build up?

With Spironolactone you can easily afford to go to 400mg, at least. But people are having to go to 150mg bicalutamide as well. Take DHTcel, Ries for example. That's why I find it hard to believe those people who say it by itself is a cure.

 

[I'mme]

On a very personal level and to be incredibly honest, I find Reis and DHTcel's regimen - High T and high E with most of T blocked in skin and hair - particularly compelling and in compliance with bodybuilding goals. If they report some great success, I would without thinking jump of that regimen.

 

[Ikarus]

I know it’s only been 4.5 months but... I have this stubborn area... It’s an evident ‘patch’ where it’s slower.

 

[Ikarus]

With Spironolactone you can easily afford to go to 400mg, at least. But people are having to go to 150mg bicalutamide as well. Take DHTcel, Ries for example. That's why I find it hard to believe those people who say it by itself is a cure.

DHTcel went to 150mg/day because he decided to make his T almost 1500 ng/dL... He doesn’t necessarily need 150mg/day, he would have been fine with 100mg/day but it’s his decision.

 

[Ikarus]

How are you doing with 50mg/day?

50mg/day is fine. It’s enough to do it’s job, since my T was 136 ng/dL when I had my last blood test. I just need to stop having unrealistic expectations...

 

[LEXUS]

Isn’t it the case that spironolactone loses effectiveness in time though? I’ve read threads of people that have used it that say they have needed to up its dose from 100 to 200 to 400 and who knows in a few more years they could be needing 1000+ mg of it daily just to maintain the gains. For this reason I don’t think it would be great in the long term as the chances of side effects build up?

you don't even need to take 400 mg of spironolactone. enough 200-300 mg. once a month instead of spironolactone for 3-4 days, take cyproterone. the body must break the habit of any drug. so I use both finasterite and dutasteride. sometimes estradiol valerate sometimes estradiol hemihydrate. spironolactone will not help you much if you take it without an avodart. all drugs must alternate. Ikarus has good hair now. but not known because of what. Maybe it's because of spironolactone. or because he changed the drug. any drug is addictive.

 

[baba_yaga]

spironolactone does not have an antigonadotrophin effect and its a very weak partial agonist of the androgen receptor,
Cypro is also a very weak partial agonist of the androgen receptor But it is an antigonadotrophin,
Bica Is a pure antagonist of the androgen receptor But it has a Gonadotrophin effect

Cypro's good point is its antigonadotrophin effect
Bica's good point is its pure antagonist ability
cypro and bica have pros and cons to each other, however, spironolactone lacks both advantages. in terms of antiandrogenic activity that is

Is bica's gonadotrophin effect bad? I looked it up quick and it seems to be related to reproductive capacity?

 

[bridgeburn]

but talking hairloss and providing regrowth, which it has done for almost everyone who has taken it, and which also explains my inclusion of other factors like prolactin, TGF-beta1, inflammation and fibrosis

I'm not sold on the idea that prolactin is negative. This guy took 200mg of cypro ED (a drug which normally elevates prolactin 10x normal amount) and it didn't seem to affect gains:

plus estrogen elevates prolactin some as well, and many have gotten results from the Diane-35, which has EE plus 2mg cypro. as in the case of Two-Hen:

As for the other factors, those are caused by testosterone and DHT so I would imagine a stronger Anti-androgen effect would help against those too.

don't get me wrong, spironolactone is fine if you take a high enough dose of it and there's different individual sensitivity and level of hairloss aggression

 

[baba_yaga]

View attachment 124727

I know it’s only been 4.5 months but... I have this stubborn area... It’s an evident ‘patch’ where it’s slower.

Lets suppose even if all your hair doesnt grow back (i really hope it does), think of it this way: you will never be bald, which is infinitely better than being bald obviously.

 

[LEXUS]

all meat products before you get to our table is cut off with testosterone for a quick set of muscle mass

not. animals are fed progesterone and estrogen and growth hormone. Testosterone is not used because it is expensive and not profitable. meat is full of estrogen. Especially since they sell only the meat of females. males before puberty are killed, because meat with testosterone is not tasty and smelly. there is a lot of estrogen in meat and it is good for hair and for youth. hair and nails from it grow faster. One thing that is harmful to hair is carbohydrates.

 

[bridgeburn]

Isn’t it the case that spironolactone loses effectiveness in time though?

pretty much Anything less than full chemical or physical castration with HRT can lose effectiveness over time.. same thing happens with finasteride and dutasteride, it may work for 10 years and then start losing again. . samething often happens with prostate cancer stronger and stronger treatments are needed.

 

[bridgeburn]

Is bica's gonadotrophin effect bad? I looked it up quick and it seems to be related to reproductive capacity?

Its good for maintaining testicular function.. but elevated T can lead to more DHT and there will inevitably some competition for recepors (which bica does a fantastic job at but I'm still cautious because of any potential once-in-a-million times T or DHT might win a receptor, better safe than sorry and better take bica with an Antigonadotrophin such as estradiol to counteract its gonadotrophin effect)

 

[bridgeburn]

@I'mme do other AA's not reduce dhea and adrenal adrogens? If that is true then spironolactone does have one advantage