Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[John Difool]

Total testosterone:
Men 270–1070 ng/dL (9–38 nmol/L)
Women 15–70 ng/dL (0.52–2.4 nmol/L)L

You are in the mid-range male T. If your goal is to lower your T you could start with CPA 6.25mg daily (50mg pill split in 8) and do another test in 4 weeks. I am not a doctor so you should definitely run it by a professional if you have access to someone who can prescribe it for you.

Oral CPA has been studied at low dosages of 5 to 20 mg/day as a potential male hormonal contraceptive. A dosage of as low as 5 to 10 mg/day oral CPA has been found to suppress circulating testosterone levels in men by 50 to 70%.

 

[Ikarus]

Bica was pretty successful in a small clinical trial of women, but I think @Ikarus is the only one here who has gotten regrowth on bica. Or maybe he got the bulk of his regrowth when he was on spironolactone? For reasons I posted in the estrogen thread, spironolactone just might be superior to bica, and eplerenone might be able to replace spironolactone without the sides.

I got most of my regrowth from oral minoxidil, if I’m being entirely honest... Bica doesn’t really give regrowth, it’s just superior with Androgenic suppression, which is why I prefer bica over any other AA

 

[Ikarus]

would it be beneficial to take CPA once a week, while taking spironolactone and estradiol daily?
edit: (assuming it wouldn't lead to testosterone fluctuation)

There would be no point at all, in all honesty...

I’m also in disbelief that no AA to date has impacted my extremely oily scalp and awful dandruff. It certainly wasn’t the reason I started more aggressive treatment, but how the hell could 100mg of bicalutamide daily + nizoral not treat my dandruff? My body makes no sense.

It’s not treating oiliness? Are you sure that’s not just your body trying to compensate for the lack of sebum production due to nizoral being quite harsh? Try using conditioner on your scalp and see if that does anything.

 

[Ikarus]

I started my new routine trying to combine bicalutamide and CPA to limit side effects about a week ago. Unfortunately delayed shipments have complicated what was supposed to be a more slow and methodical process. I’m almost out of bicalutamide so I’m taking 25mg CPA and 50mg bicalutamide daily for now but soon that’s going to turn into just 25mg CPA daily. I’ve experienced acne, more oily skin, and it seems like my libido is increasing. It’s hard to tell if hair fall has increased as well or if I’m just more paranoid about it. Ever since I cut my hair short my thinning spots have become much more obvious. I’m pretty terrified by these side effects because it makes me think I’m losing ground, but I’m hoping it’s just a phase of adjustment like the one I had when I switched from Spironolactone to bicalutamide monotherapy. Hopefully CPA can give me the results I’m looking for because it’s my last option before I’m forced to start taking estrogen, and I’m not sure I’m willing to do that.

Do not combine a high dose of CPA and bicalutamide. If you want help with your regimen, join our discord server due to higher activity there, although it definitely does have a larger LGBT base compared to it being centred directly for hair loss.

 

[Ikarus]

Update on my hair: I’d say I’m at 70% density, and my frontal is improving slowly but surely. I don’t require hair fibres to leave my house, which says something. My hair colour has darkened, and my hair texture has become more wavy.

 

[mryellowman]

I got most of my regrowth from oral minoxidil, if I’m being entirely honest... Bica doesn’t really give regrowth, it’s just superior with Androgenic suppression, which is why I prefer bica over any other AA

Are u still using estrogen ? I have been on bica for months now and all i could gain is gyno and weight.Seems like really not doing anything without minoxidil or estrogen. What a disappointment.

 

[John Difool]

If you understand how Bica works, that could alleviate or suppress your disappointment.

Check your T level for baseline. Then realise that T are not going to lower with Bica. But binding to AR is determined by a ratio depending on how much T you have. Bica will boost your T & E because the body will notice absence of binding. It can go as high as 50%. That's usually what throws people off: T are not lowering. But that's okay because they won't bind to AR either. So you keep your T, don't lose libido but don't get the negative effects of T include hair loss. Using a unproven formulation you can figure out the dosage of Bica. Usually the dosage is 50mg. But Bica monotherapy won't work unless you boost that dosage to block all T including the ones that are generated because of Bica. It can go up to 150mg. The way to introduce a less expensive treatment is to use E (2mg and more) and to lower T with a low dose of CPA (12.5mg). Those work well together. spironolactone is a weaker AA so won't bring much and may even compete with Bica. Bica is also much safer than spironolactone and a nonsteroid with less sides. If you want to cover that T which can still convert to DHT use an AA like Duta or Fina and add topical RU.

 

[pegasus2]

Even castration doesn't reverse hair loss, so you can't expect something like bica to work by itself.

 

[Gergely]

So basicaly oral minoxidil, CPA, E and Duta + castration

 

[John Difool]

So basicaly oral minoxidil, CPA, E and Duta + castration

And wounding. You won't need much Bica & CPA if you are castrated. E will help with regrowth

 

[Derelict]

Even castration doesn't reverse hair loss, so you can't expect something like bica to work by itself.

Yeah the guy who castrated himself and made a thread on here about it still has problems with his crown, E alone wasn't enough, had to add minoxidil.

 

[Manochoice]

@bridgeburn crazy, crazy regrowth

 

[mryellowman]

Even castration doesn't reverse hair loss, so you can't expect something like bica to work by itself.

Why shouldn't i expect ? It can boost your estrogen to high levels, that's why it has like 80% gyno ratio. Not everybody who got regrowth gets it from minoxidil. That's why it disappointed me. Something that blocks most of your T's and boost your estrogen can't give you a bit regrowth.

 

[mryellowman]

If you understand how Bica works, that could alleviate or suppress your disappointment.

Check your T level for baseline. Then realise that T are not going to lower with Bica. But binding to AR is determined by a ratio depending on how much T you have. Bica will boost your T & E because the body will notice absence of binding. It can go as high as 50%. That's usually what throws people off: T are not lowering. But that's okay because they won't bind to AR either. So you keep your T, don't lose libido but don't get the negative effects of T include hair loss. Using a unproven formulation you can figure out the dosage of Bica. Usually the dosage is 50mg. But Bica monotherapy won't work unless you boost that dosage to block all T including the ones that are generated because of Bica. It can go up to 150mg. The way to introduce a less expensive treatment is to use E (2mg and more) and to lower T with a low dose of CPA (12.5mg). Those work well together. spironolactone is a weaker AA so won't bring much and may even compete with Bica. Bica is also much safer than spironolactone and a nonsteroid with less sides. If you want to cover that T which can still convert to DHT use an AA like Duta or Fina and add topical RU.

The problem is if im going to use cpa or estrogen in order to bica works, why would i need bica at all ? There are tons of people who got regrowth from cpa or E or combined. I choosed bica because it is safer option than these two. I choosed bica because i don't want to use cpa or E.

Something that should block most of your T's while combined with dutasteride and boost your estrogen should give you satisfying results.

"So you keep your T, don't lose libido but don't get the negative effects of T include hair loss."

This also wrong. You might not get libido loss etc. but it's not guarenteed. Increased estrogen can cause libido loss or other problems. I was using dutasteride alone and adding bica changed everything to another level. So there is no dream world where you use bica, keeping your masculine futures and get your hair back. You have to be so lucky.

 

[John Difool]

I know.

This also wrong. You might not get libido loss etc. but it's not guarenteed.

So this not guaranteed but I am wrong?! okay sure whatever.

Every one is different, and there are not many studies of hair regrowth for males using Bica (studies focus on women.) Bica works well as AA but more benefit comes from Bica with lower doses of CPA (in my case) & E to fight higher T and E and resulting DHT. Bica monotherapy is a very difficult thing to get right because beside a rule of thumbs it's not possible to measure T to check range. It can vary from 150-600mg per day to be effective. Dropping a low dose of CPA can lower more efficiently T levels so there are less to deal with at the AR. Not all DHT comes from the T that Bica targets and you also need that progesterone-like effects by activating the progesterone receptor (PR). E for example 2mg is added to balance on the H axis. CPA at 12.5mg is significantly less harmful and more economical. Ymnv so check for those liver levels. If money is not a problem and you want to continue on that non steroidal path, you can try more expensive stuff like enzalutamide or darolutamide which has a lower potency and shorter half life.

Regarding libido, my comments are based personal experience only, not trying to set a general theory. I guess I should add a legal disclaimer at the end of my posts that I am not a doctor and doing it your own way will result in whatever choices and tradeoffs (physical, psychological and financial.)

I was sold on Bica for its non steroidal mechanism and less side. I have concluded in my case that higher T that can't bind don't result in the catastrophic sexual side effect Spyro got me living like a zombie. spironolactone for hair loss presents other advantages so it's about finding what works for you and keeping at it. But I also noticed that at 50mg AA is not that great with Bica unless you start looking seriously at HRT and mixing stuff.

I am fairly new at this stuff. In the short time I have been dealing with hair loss actively, I already noticed that there is no magic recipe or magic pill. Each treatment offers benefits and brings issues that can snowball into bringing other drugs to combat depending what your end goal is. Some people still believe that sex drive and hair growth are separate matters. I learned that it's a fragile balance that's not easy to find.

 

[mryellowman]

I know.


So this not guaranteed but I am wrong?! okay sure whatever.

Every one is different, and there are not many studies of hair regrowth for males using Bica (studies focus on women.) Bica works well as AA but more benefit comes from Bica with lower doses of CPA (in my case) & E to fight higher T and E and resulting DHT. Bica monotherapy is a very difficult thing to get right because beside a rule of thumbs it's not possible to measure T to check range. It can vary from 150-600mg per day to be effective. Dropping a low dose of CPA can lower more efficiently T levels so there are less to deal with at the AR. Not all DHT comes from the T that Bica targets and you also need that progesterone-like effects by activating the progesterone receptor (PR). E for example 2mg is added to balance on the H axis. CPA at 12.5mg is significantly less harmful and more economical. Ymnv so check for those liver levels. If money is not a problem and you want to continue on that non steroidal path, you can try more expensive stuff like enzalutamide or darolutamide which has a lower potency and shorter half life.

Regarding libido, my comments are based personal experience only, not trying to set a general theory. I guess I should add a legal disclaimer at the end of my posts that I am not a doctor and doing it your own way will result in whatever choices and tradeoffs (physical, psychological and financial.)

I was sold on Bica for its non steroidal mechanism and less side. I have concluded in my case that higher T that can't bind don't result in the catastrophic sexual side effect Spyro got me living like a zombie. spironolactone for hair loss presents other advantages so it's about finding what works for you and keeping at it. But I also noticed that at 50mg AA is not that great with Bica unless you start looking seriously at HRT and mixing stuff.

I am fairly new at this stuff. In the short time I have been dealing with hair loss actively, I already noticed that there is no magic recipe or magic pill. Each treatment offers benefits and brings issues that can snowball into bringing other drugs to combat depending what your end goal is. Some people still believe that sex drive and hair growth are separate matters. I learned that it's a fragile balance that's not easy to find.

You don't need to add a disclaimer. As i understood from your sentence, you said it like it is a certain thing that's why i said its wrong. No big deal.
When this drug first discussed here it was introduced like a magical hair pill for males. People claimed you wouldn't get any sexual side effects because of its mechanism but nobody included its estrogen boost.

It varies from person to person. This drug is used for prostate cancer for so many years and its a well known drug so when its side effect list contains sexual side effects, you can't say it has no sexual side effect for certain. Im not talking about you, its been introduced wrong here and im just sharing my experience for other people that might try this drug, you can get side effects.

As for your suggestions, i don't think i will try at higher doses unless i see some success stories on such high doses. Maybe im being impatient i don't know. I have been taking this drug for like 6 months EOD at 50 mg and like i said i still haven't seen anything for hair profit. I was super good while on dutasteride no sexual sides at all but this drug gave me libido loss, loss of semen volume , gyno , weight increase, reduced body hair etc. That's why im dissappointed. After sacrificied so many things and get nothing from it ? Most importantly it cost me 6 months of my time. Im just thinking taking a break, continue with dutasteride alone and oberve people's stories than i will decide what to continue on.

 

[TomRiddle]

You don't need to add a disclaimer. As i understood from your sentence, you said it like it is a certain thing that's why i said its wrong. No big deal.
When this drug first discussed here it was introduced like a magical hair pill for males. People claimed you wouldn't get any sexual side effects because of its mechanism but nobody included its estrogen boost.

It varies from person to person. This drug is used for prostate cancer for so many years and its a well known drug so when its side effect list contains sexual side effects, you can't say it has no sexual side effect for certain. Im not talking about you, its been introduced wrong here and im just sharing my experience for other people that might try this drug, you can get side effects.

Nobody's fault that your taking for granted "medical advise" from insecure, retarded and mentally ill kids from a hairloss forum. We and me personally have posted tons of information about this drug, all being ignored and downplayed by the bunch of retarded fucks who think they are doctors or some kind of scientists from their mothers basements after reading some studies and anecdotal reports...

Unfortunately you can't guard and warn all the people who visit these forums about it's dangers, meaning the mentally ill fucks who are castrating themselves and after saying that they are still males or perfectly healthy and so on and that encourage others to go on their route. I'm sorry for your experience but in the same time you kind of deserve it for trusting blindly a bunch of unknown retards from a hairloss forum...

 

[mryellowman]

Nobody's fault that your taking for granted "medical advise" from insecure, retarded and mentally ill kids from a hairloss forum. We and me personally have posted tons of information about this drug, all being ignored and downplayed by the bunch of retarded fucks who think they are doctors or some kind of scientists from their mothers basements after reading some studies and anecdotal reports...

Unfortunately you can't guard and warn all the people who visit these forums about it's dangers, meaning the mentally ill fucks who are castrating themselves and after saying that they are still males or perfectly healthy and so on and that encourage others to go on their route. I'm sorry for your experience but in the same time you kind of deserve it for trusting blindly a bunch of unknown retards from a hairloss forum...

Im not blaming anyone. I was aware the sides and i chose to go for it. I knew this drug while nobody knew even its name. Because my grandfather's been taking it over 10 years for prostate cancer. But i can admit i kinda started because of the hype. You don't need to be sorry for me because i have recovered before from it. Like i said i pity my wasted time.

While i dislike your attitude about general ( you and me i think battled before because of it ), Im on your side about advertising it like a magical pill. Everyone needs to know what they are meddling with. If a person choose to go this route while knowing the possibilities then everybody should respect his choice and not insult him.

 

[John Difool]

Sure everyone should read the fine prints and preferably ask their endo. If you are expecting Bica to regrow alone as a monotherapy and you don't want to add E that is not gonna work. Same for Cypro and spironolactone. AA don't regrow hair at best they chemically castrate you and you need E to recover. The worse situation is to use Bica grow boobs and lose your libido and keep losing hair. Life can suck that way.


Did I misunderstand your concern?

 

[Guido]

One question, my next regimen will be cyproterone, but I don't want to use high doses just 25 mg a day, I would like to combine it with flutsmide or bicalutamide.
My question is, will blood testosterone drop or rise?
cyproteone decreases lh but bica increases testosterone by positive feedback.