Finasteride Or Dutasteride? Which Is Better? 7 Words

[Michael1986]

Duasteride in studies have been shown to be slightly more effective (not amazingly so) but this is moreso because it more completely inhibits 5AR2. While inhibiting 5AR1 will further decrease DHT serum levels, 5AR1 has very little, if anything, to do with balding. Merck tested a 5AR1 inhibitor and it was barely more effective than the placebo. 'BARELY', so it was slightly more effective but not nearly enough to use it. Pseudohermaphordites who never go bald also lack 5AR2 but still have 5AR1.

Yes I agree that the DHT from the type 2 enzyme is that which is primarily responsible for hair loss, as I mentioned in an earlier post. As you say, the DHT from 5ar type 1 may play a small role in hair loss but it is not the main contributor.

 

[Retinoid]

Yes I agree that the DHT from the type 2 enzyme is that which is primarily responsible for hair loss, as I mentioned in an earlier post. As you say, the DHT from 5ar type 1 may play a small role in hair loss but it is not the main contributor.

Since the pseudohermaphordites have their youthful hair lines into old age and have this enzyme, 5AR1 probably plays NO role however for arguments sake, lack of 5AR1 pobably helps slightly but at the same time really doesn't do anything significant. Duasteride blocking this will just cause more side effects. Especially considering this enzyme is in places such as the liver and brain.

 

[Michael1986]

Since the pseudohermaphordites have their youthful hair lines into old age and have this enzyme, 5AR1 probably plays NO role however for arguments sake, lack of 5AR1 pobably helps slightly but at the same time really doesn't do anything significant. Duasteride blocking this will just cause more side effects. Especially considering this enzyme is in places such as the liver and brain.

Yes indeed. I personally would not want to take dutasteride at any dose higher than 0.5mg a day, precisely because of the 5ar1 inhibition. Some dutasteride users take 2mg or 2.5mg a day, which I see as being very risky. A 2.5mg dosing scheme will result in 85% of the DHT from 5ar1 being removed.
Having 50% of the DHT from this enzyme removed is a risk I'm willing to take. After all, enzyme levels do vary naturally between different individuals quite considerably, and even with 50% of my 5ar1 DHT removed, it is still likely to be within normal limits. However, I would not personally want to be taking dutasteride at 2mg or 2.5mg. Having 85% of your 5ar1 DHT removed is a big risk to be taking, considering this DHT is present in the brain tissue in measurable amounts.

 

[Retinoid]

Yes indeed. I personally would not want to take dutasteride at any dose higher than 0.5mg a day, precisely because of the 5ar1 inhibition. Some dutasteride users take 2mg or 2.5mg a day, which I see as being very risky. A 2.5mg dosing scheme will result in 85% of the DHT from 5ar1 being removed.
Having 50% of the DHT from this enzyme removed is a risk I'm willing to take. After all, enzyme levels do vary naturally between different individuals quite considerably, and even with 50% of my 5ar1 DHT removed, it is still likely to be within normal limits. However, I would not personally want to be taking dutasteride at 2mg or 2.5mg. Having 85% of your 5ar1 DHT removed is a big risk to be taking, considering this DHT is present in the brain tissue in measurable amounts.

Did you use Finasteride? I take .5mg of Propecia per day and it is so far successful. I definitely do feel like the body upregulates 5AR1 with Finasteride which is why people notice an increase in pimples or oily skin or more body hair. I have gotten some body pimples here and there (when I have not had any since puberty) and my hair has definitely grown more on my legs (I had very little hair for years in certain areas where I acutely noticed it and now it is hairy). Though it is not extreme. I never had a shed, most likely because Minoxidil had me go through horrendous shedding prior.

With Duasteride it may even be worth taking it 3x per week after a loading dose of .5mg/day. This may reduce side effects and should be equally effective due to the very long half life.

 

[itsjustsimon]

I think that the effectiveness of dutasteride over a long period compared to finasteride is underrated.

But, the same could be said for side effects.

 

[AnxiousAndy]

Am I the only one who thinks that reducing 5AR1 despite being present in the brain wont actually affect anything? ( Besides sexual things ) When we were kids we had no 5AR1 in our brains and functioned just fine. Women likely don't have any of it either ( If they do its probably a very small amount ) and function just fine. I know they have estrogen but that doesn't act anything like DHT would. What do you guys think?

 

[Michael1986]

Am I the only one who thinks that reducing 5AR1 despite being present in the brain wont actually affect anything? ( Besides sexual things ) When we were kids we had no 5AR1 in our brains and functioned just fine. Women likely don't have any of it either ( If they do its probably a very small amount ) and function just fine. I know they have estrogen but that doesn't act anything like DHT would. What do you guys think?

I've never read anything that says women and children don't have 5ar1 in their brains. Do you have a reference for that claim?
5ar1 must be present in our brains for a reason. It wouldn't be in the brain in the first place if it served no function whatsoever.
What is interesting is that unlike 5ar2 deficiency, there is no biological model for 5ar1 deficiency. This suggests that congenital 5ar1 deficiency is invariably lethal to a developing embryo.
There is also a third 5ar enzyme, 5ar3, which is potently inhibited by both finasteride and dutasteride. Like 5ar1, it is also present in the brain. Evidence shows that it has a critical role in cell metabolism, and that its main function is to synthesize a specific type of alcohol called "dolichol". This alcohol has an essential role in protein folding within the endoplasmic reticulum of cells for the very beginning stages of glycosylation. Evidence also suggests that 5ar3 converts testosterone to DHT. Individuals who are born with mutations in the gene that codes for 5ar3 display a wide range of serious health problems such as severe mental retardation, psychomotor retardation, serious eye problems, skin abnormalities, bone and joint abnormalities, and coarse facial features.

 

[Michael1986]

I should add that the inhibition of these 5ar enzymes is probably a lot less critical in adult males than in prenatal fetuses. If it was absolutely critical for an adult male to have these enzymes at their natural, non-inhibited amounts, the side-effects we experience from finasteride and dutasteride would be much, much worse than they are.

 

[michel sapin]

the only damn thing is that DHT act as an antagonist to oestradiol . So with duta there is more chance of gyno for the sensitive individuals

 

[AnxiousAndy]

I've never read anything that says women and children don't have 5ar1 in their brains. Do you have a reference for that claim?
5ar1 must be present in our brains for a reason. It wouldn't be in the brain in the first place if it served no function whatsoever.
What is interesting is that unlike 5ar2 deficiency, there is no biological model for 5ar1 deficiency. This suggests that congenital 5ar1 deficiency is invariably lethal to a developing embryo.
There is also a third 5ar enzyme, 5ar3, which is potently inhibited by both finasteride and dutasteride. Like 5ar1, it is also present in the brain. Evidence shows that it has a critical role in cell metabolism, and that its main function is to synthesize a specific type of alcohol called "dolichol". This alcohol has an essential role in protein folding within the endoplasmic reticulum of cells for the very beginning stages of glycosylation. Evidence also suggests that 5ar3 converts testosterone to DHT. Individuals who are born with mutations in the gene that codes for 5ar3 display a wide range of serious health problems such as severe mental retardation, psychomotor retardation, serious eye problems, skin abnormalities, bone and joint abnormalities, and coarse facial features.

I never said for definite they didn't. If DHT is a male hormone then its safe to say that they will have far higher levels of it than compared to women and children, which presumably also means the amount of 5AR1 in the brains of the women and children would be significantly less than that of a man, possibly less than what dutasteride inhibits. I don't have any reference, but I don't think its crazy to assume what I'm saying would be right. I'm not saying it doesn't serve a purpose, because it clearly does. What I'm saying is that outside of sexual side effects I can't see how it could affect anything else as women and children very likely have much lower levels of it. I don't doubt there is no model for a 5AR1 deficiency but I don't see how a grown man has any need for it, its the same reason why nobody knows why older men even need DHT. Infact they probably don't. This is all broscience I'm suggesting, if you haven't noticed.

 

[Michael1986]

I never said for definite they didn't. If DHT is a male hormone then its safe to say that they will have far higher levels of it than compared to women and children, which presumably also means the amount of 5AR1 in the brains of the women and children would be significantly less than that of a man, possibly less than what dutasteride inhibits. I don't have any reference, but I don't think its crazy to assume what I'm saying would be right. I'm not saying it doesn't serve a purpose, because it clearly does. What I'm saying is that outside of sexual side effects I can't see how it could affect anything else as women and children very likely have much lower levels of it. I don't doubt there is no model for a 5AR1 deficiency but I don't see how a grown man has any need for it, its the same reason why nobody knows why older men even need DHT. Infact they probably don't. This is all broscience I'm suggesting, if you haven't noticed.

Yes you're right, you didn't state it as fact.
It's hard to say how much an adult really needs DHT after puberty.
I read a study that showed that dutasteride actually has neuroprotective properties and that it protects against alzheimers. So in addition to growing hair, dutasteride can have other positive effects on us and not all negative as some anti-propecia or anti-dutasteride people might wish to claim.

 

[Retinoid]

Yes you're right, you didn't state it as fact.
It's hard to say how much an adult really needs DHT after puberty.
I read a study that showed that dutasteride actually has neuroprotective properties and that it protects against alzheimers. So in addition to growing hair, dutasteride can have other positive effects on us and not all negative as some anti-propecia or anti-dutasteride people might wish to claim.

It is probably like MAOIs. If you inhibit MAO when you are older you for the most part are fine and it could be beneficial. 5AR could be like this but at this time there are mainly only studies about how bad 5AR inhibitors are.