Help - Red Hairs! How To Get Rid Of Them?

[esc2000]

I got a blonde piece with 20% gray that I got professionally dyed to dark brown. The next morning I am noticing some reddish hairs! Not sure if these are grays that got dyed (doubt it, they were synthetic grays which are supposedly dye proof) or if they are browns that did not go fully brown and for some reason turned red. Help!!! Is there anything I can do to make these stand out less. Thanks!

Tried searching function but "red" was too short of a term to be allowed.

 

[Noah]

I got a blonde piece with 20% gray that I got professionally dyed to dark brown. The next morning I am noticing some reddish hairs! Not sure if these are grays that got dyed (doubt it, they were synthetic grays which are supposedly dye proof) or if they are browns that did not go fully brown and for some reason turned red. Help!!! Is there anything I can do to make these stand out less. Thanks!

Tried searching function but "red" was too short of a term to be allowed.

That's a nuisance. Maybe try an anti-red colour-correcting shampoo to see if that solves it, before you resort to anything more drastic?

 

[esc2000]

That's a nuisance. Maybe try an anti-red colour-correcting shampoo to see if that solves it, before you resort to anything more drastic?

Thanks Noah. Yeah I'll try to get one of those shampoos. Have you used any brands personally that you can suggest? Otherwise no worries I can do a search.

The nuclear option is just tweezing them. Hopefully that is safe on a Swiss lace piece.

 

[Noah]

I have fair hair, so I need a different kind of colour correction. You need a blue shampoo to take out red tones. But there are a few different brands on Amazon and Hair Direct. You can also get them in the supermarket, because women who dye their hair have the same issue.

If you have to resort to tweezing, soak the piece in warm water for 10 or 15 minutes beforehand. That lubricates the knots a bit, and makes the hair in the knots swell up, which makes the knots easier to slip out, so less likelihood of you ripping the mesh.

 

[esc2000]

Hi Noah - when using a blue shampoo or conditioner - do you apply it with a comb to avoid base staining? How do you rinse it?

 

[lace]

Noah's suggestion to use "blue" shampoo might help. But before you decide you really need to better understand color and color issues as it relates to hair. I am a professional artist and colorist (not coloiist as it apples to the color specialists often found in hair salons.). I work with traditional paint and brushes and I work digitally creating imagery regularly for designers......commercial and residential. ....worldwide as well as art consultants, galleries, etc. I typically have to mix to colors to exact specifications based on a designer's color scheme. Color mixing is a science.
Back to blue shampoo. The reason one often sees the recommendation of" blue" shampoo is because human hair hair pieces eventually become brassy. Brassy by definition has a strong orange component. Orange is created by mixing red and yellow. On a color wheel, if an artist wants to neutralize a color (desaturate, reduce chroma) the artist selects the color opposite, 180 degrees, on the color wheel. Opposite orange is blue. Thus the blue shampoo recommendation. The OP of this thread states he has "red" hairs. Opposite red on a color wheel is green. Thus the OP might want to consider "green" shampoo.
Do a Google search for blue shampoo and for green shampoo. Lots of links and some very interesting reading.
I came across this link.
http://www.theperfumeexpert.com/how-to-fix-brassy-hair-and-remove-other-unwanted-red-tones/
Well written, and, from a color theory perspective very accurate. The writer wants to sell an ebook. But she presents great information on this link for free. It is a good read. There is also a color wheel on the link. Checkout red and orange and their corresponding complements.....180 degree opposites.
Also read user comments below the link As expected a mix of responses. Nothing unusual about that. This forum, particularly the "baldness is death side" with all the solutions, magical treatments, drugs, cures, etc is filled with some quite nasty confrontations and disagreements. It is the internet. To be expected.
When I mix color for my bio hair sides and back, or if I am correcting hair color on a hair piece (human not synthetic) I use a mix of dark ash, dark brunette and a touch of black usually with 20 developer or 30 developer. Never 40. The brunette darkens the ash. But it also adds a slight red cast. A very small touch of black desaturates the red cast.. This is not a process for the beginner. But if anyone on this forum is having similar issues with color either on their bio hair or their hair piece that has now changed color (brassy or otherwise) I am willing to provide suggestions and caveats.
To the OP. In your post you do not detail the frequency of the red hairs. Many or only a few? Also what kind of light are you using to view the color? Light source makes a huge difference. I paint with 5500 Kelvin lighting because it is color neutral. Professionals in all fields when evaluating color typically use "viewing booths "that are color neutral. When working digitally I use a colorimeter to profile my monitor so that it accurately depicts color. The point I am making is color is complicated! Everyone's hair piece changes color appearance with light.......sun, shadow, blue sky, halogen, florescent etc. Produce different color perceptions.
If you only have a few red hairs I would remove them manually rather than get into all these color issues. Tweezers work. I prefer a German ventilating needle with needle holder. The needle easily slides into the knot facilitating easy loosening and removal. Less chance of lace damage.

 

[esc2000]

Thank you for the detailed reply! It's not tons of red hairs nut enough that tweezing seems like a difficult task. I heard good thinks aboit Black Malva shampoo for green/red neutralization. Any experience?

I also want to find a solution that works in case I get more reds going fwd as sun damage occurs.

I worried because the few reds kind of look metallic red...not a natural look.

What's the worst that can happen if I apply back malva for a couple minutes and wash out? My hair system is a dark brown.

Thanks again. Will read link later at work, but I had ready read a lot about the blue/green/purple debate. Still slightly confused but understanding it more.

 

[lace]

Hope I did not overwhelm and scare you. I could have easily written much more.

I have not used Black Malva. But it has been mentioned often. Particularly on the NWLace forum. Your post there may get some replies from users. You are right about "what could happen..." Likely nothing if the duration is short. The same applies to permanent hair dye. By shortening the duration and using a 30 developer vs a 20 the result is much less dramatic.......usually. I suspect that Malva is primarily a conditioner/hair color rinse. Try a short duration. Then wear the piece for a couple days. See what happens. Bad surprises sometimes don't show up right away. Also read this.....https://www.makeupalley.com/product...752/Black-Malva-Conditioner/AVEDA/Conditioner

Post your results and always remember this truism when making any changes to a hair piece: Error on the side of caution!

 

[BaldBearded]

Hi, could someone explain the benefits of ordering a system, not in the color you need, and then dying it?

 

[lace]

Not something I would do.

In theory a blond piece eliminates the need to bleach knots. But if one is not planning an exposed hairline then it really makes no sense to me. The problem with dying a blond hair piece is keeping color off of the knots. If the knots get colored then what was the reason to buy blond? No reason. Really makes no sense.

The question for esc2000 is...did the salon avoid coloring the knots? Dying an entire hair piece and avoiding the knots is not easy.

 

[esc2000]

Not something I would do.

In theory a blond piece eliminates the need to bleach knots. But if one is not planning an exposed hairline then it really makes no sense to me. The problem with dying a blond hair piece is keeping color off of the knots. If the knots get colored then what was the reason to buy blond? No reason. Really makes no sense.

The question for esc2000 is...did the salon avoid coloring the knots? Dying an entire hair piece and avoiding the knots is not easy.

Yes they avoided coloring the knots. The slight downside is the first cm or so is blonde of most hairs. I will try to learn how to do this myself. I wear a front partial. For toppers may be easier to just order the front 2 inches in blonde and do it yourself.

I prefer bleached knots but my experience with ordering bleached knots is that the knots are still super visible and gridlike. So clearly the factories don't bother, or don't do it well. Perhaps I can bleach knots on my own, but seems hard and dangerous.

 

[lace]

Really not that hard and dangerous. I used to do it regularly. If you decide to try it let me know. I will describe what worked for me and possible complications.

 

[Noah]

Wow Lace man, that's a lot of information. I think you have to be an expert to process all that stuff LOL. Most of us are simple souls. I have fair/blondish hair which can get a greenish tinge from the sun. A purple colour correcting shampoo takes the green out. I have been told (and seen) that if you have dark hair it can get a reddish tinge from the sun, and a blue/green colour correcting shampoo neutralises that reddishness.

Can you simplify your info down to a suggestion as to what you would use?

 

[esc2000]

Really not that hard and dangerous. I used to do it regularly. If you decide to try it let me know. I will describe what worked for me and possible complications.

Lace, actually I wouldn't mind learning how to bleach knots. What products did you use and which process did you undertake? I've heard that some people first use a fabric dye remover on the inside base of the piece and then bleach after that.

I have a few spare stock pieces that I could test on.

Thank you!

 

[lace]

Noah.........
It may seem like a lot of info, but, if you read the info a few times I think you will conclude that it is not that complicated. Nevertheless I shall simplify.
1. You need to view a color wheel.
2. Basic principle of color and a color wheel is the complement color is 180 degrees opposite the color one wants to neutralize (hair color for instance) on the color wheel.
3. The complement color neutralizes (desaturates) the color (hair color).
4. Noah...you state that you have fair(as in light) blondish color. Blond is in the YELLOW family. On the color wheel what color is opposite YELLOW? Answer...PURPLE (violet). You are using the correct colored shampoo.
5. Excluding BLACK which technically is not a color.....black is the absence of light., and grey is simply BLACK tinted with WHITE....hair piece colors fall into 2 color families: YELLOW as in blond, RED as in the BROWN family which includes brunette and ash. Using a color wheel, the opposite of RED is GREEN. Therefore a green solution likely the best.. YELLOW (blond) per above requires a purple solution.
6. Oxidation which happens to every human hair piece over time produces a BRASSY color. BRASSY is in the ORANGE family. Opposite Orange on a color wheel is BLUE. BLUE solution likely to produce the best result

You mentioned that you have been told that dark colors get a reddish tint and that blue green reduces the red. Mostly true. Dark colors more likely become reddish orange (brassy). BLUE GREEN solution likely to work because blue and green are opposite red and orange..

Simplified!!!

 

[lace]

Forgot the color wheel.

 

[lace]

esc2000. ....bleaching.
You can find many different methods on the internet. I will describe the method I used. It always worked for me.
1. I won't recommend any specific brand. Bleach is very basic. Any powdered bleach should work. If you are in the USA Sallys is great for all hair products . Knowledgeable staff. I simply asked a staff member to recommend a bleach. She said any of their breaches would work. She also suggested a 30 developer. Worked for me.
2. Read and follow directions for mixing on the label!!
3. Setup.....Styrofoam head. G clamp is nice to have to securely hold the Styrofoam head but I doubt that you have one. Instead just use tape to hold the head in place. You do not want it to move or tip over during the process. Plastic wrap.......same as you used to make the template. Cheap brush to apply the bleach. 1" works good. Small glass or plastic cup or bowl for mixing. Plastic spoon or something similar for stirring. No metal!! Plastic or rubber gloves are optional. A few straight pins to secure the hair piece and plastic wrap. Some kind of hair clips to keep the hair on the hair side of your hair piece out of the bleach. Timer.....watch or cell phone is all you need.
4. Wear old throwaway clothing. Beach has a way of flying through the air and landing on good clothes. It also targets carpet. Best to work in the bathroom on a countertop and with a tile floor.
5. First cover the styro head with plastic and securely pin in place.
6. I only recommend bleaching around the hairline. Not the entire piece.
7. Mark the plastic wrap with an outline of the shape of your hairline.....some kind of crescent shape.
8. Use clips to securely pull top hair away from the lace edge at or near the hairline. No need to clip sides and back.
9. Start the process. Mix bleach thoroughly according to label instructions. Best if the solution is thick enough not to run. But not thick like a heavy paste.
10. Brush on bleach solution onto the plastic on the head slightly exceeding the boundary markings of the crescent shape. You want the area to be slightly larger.
11. Now lay the hair piece....LACE SIDE DOWN NOT HAIR SIDE DOWN...onto the head trying to match the crescent you marked. Do not apply pressure downwards from the hair side. If you do you will force bleach through the lace and up onto the hair shafts. You mentioned that the salon beached your knots up about 1 cm onto the hair. Likely that they either applied some kind of pressure and or used a bleach solution that was too thin causing wicking up the hair shafts. Once the hair piece is "floated" onto the bleach, gently slide it back and forth about 1-2 cm just to make sure the bleach is contacting all the knots. NO heavy pressure however. Use a few straight pins to secure the piece to the head. NO pins in the bleach area however. Note the time....a stopwatch on your cell phone is best. Lastly cover the hair piece with another layer of plastic. LOOSELY....no pressure. This keeps the bleach solution wet while it iis working.
12. How long to bleach..No way to know for sure. Dark colored knots take more time. I suggest about 15 minutes. The label may also suggest a time. But keep in mind the the bleach manufacturer was not expecting you to be be a bleaching hair piece knots.
13. After whatever time to use, carefully remove the hair piece. Initially rinse thoroughly under a faucet from the hair side flushing bleach from the knots and lace. Then turn over and flush from the lace side.
14. Take a look at your work. How do the knots look? Bleached enough or not enough? Was there any wicking up onto the hair shafts?
15. The results of 14 above will determine if you got a satisfactory result and if you still need more bleaching. Don't over bleach. Bleaching weakens hair the same way fabric bleach can weaken a fabric.
I can't comment on first using fabric dye remover. First time I have heard that.
Using an old hair piece as a learning tool is good. Just remember the hair knots you are bleaching on an old piece are likely to be different that those on a new piece. Have fun. It is not that difficult!

 

[esc2000]

Thank you lace. Very clear.

1. Why only bleach the front? To prevent shedding in other areas or is there another reason?
2. In your experience, how much has bleaching darker hair impacted hair system longevity?
3. I wasn't clear earlier - the salon dyed a blonde piece brown (which is they the 1cm at the root is still blonde, as they were conservative and didn't want to stain base). They didn't bleach knots. The question is, if one is willing to put up with the hassle, isn't it better for longevity to take the coloring a blonde piece approach rather than the bleaching? Seems like this would extend life of piece.

 

[lace]

You need to stop obsessing! On the other thread on this forum per Noah.... "wear the hair, and don't let it wear you. " You are a new wearer....correct? How many times have you attached/detached your piece? How many days have you actually worn the piece?

Per your questions above....
1. Because the front hairline is likely to be the part of the hair piece that exposes the knots (unless you plan to wear a piece with zip density.....not advisable). And, if you have a Caesar type style then no bleaching is needed.
2. How long will a new pair of shoes last? Shirt? Jeans? Car?
3. In all likelihood your piece has hair that began as dark black Asian hair. It was then heavily stripped/processed. Another processing step followed to get the blond color which did not appear spontaneously. Many blond variations exist. I suggest you buy a New Image hair ring. You will quickly learn that Brown, brunette, red, blond, ash etc are at best simply generic terms that define a "color family." 100's, 1000's of variations exist. You then had a salon process your piece again using brown. Before even wearing the piece once you already have a heavily processed piece.

As I wrote earlier in response to a post by Baldbearded I don't see the rationale for buying blond and then coloring. Why??

Relax. Stop obsessing. Start wearing. You will never have the perfect hair piece. It does not exist for anyone. If you think you now have the "best," wait until tomorrow. Hair pieces are not static. They change and eventually need to be trashed.

 

[esc2000]

It's in my personality to be quite analytic. I appreciate your advice but I will continue to be analytical (sometimes overly so). You can't teach a duck to stop quacking.

I still haven't seen a bleached knot hairline as natural looking as Unfinished Symphony's, whose approach I am following with the hair dying. Both knot bleaching and dying take effort and have risks. I don't see why one is 'obsessing' and the other is not. I want to know which one can get me the best result. Are there any hairline close-ups of DARK hairlines with just bleached knots looking as good as the one I linked? If so, then bleaching may be better/easier than dying. But dying a hairpiece every 3 months isn't exactly a herculean task. I don't think it is ridiculous to do, if it gives such an amazingly natural result.