How likely is "shock loss" after FUT?

[HT55]

Also, I would love to hear the explanation or basis from any of the indivduals you mentioned to support why shaving the recipient area will reduce shockloss. Maybe there is something I am missing or something new for me to learn.

Maybe B spot can chime in. Matt told me they would not even do my hair transplant to fill in about 1.5K grafts without me shaving down the frontal 1/3. He never mentioned it being shorter he said shaved down. If he could do it with my hair cut to even 1/2 inch I would book my procedure today. Shaving down means I need at least 4 weeks off from work.

I have had work done with Ivan Cohen without shaving and returned to work in 4 days and also had a LOT of shock loss but it all grew back eventually.

 

[Guest]

I believe the shorter hair allows for less "manipulation" of existing hair.

By this I mean that when the hair is longer and must be combed through again and again and again it can lead to more shocked hair.

(conjure the image of 2000+ incisions .7-1.1mm in existing long hair, and combing the hair to find them, let alone implant them)

This idea was never meant to minimize the idea of shockloss or to put forth that those with longer hair WILL have shockloss and those with shorter hair will NOT have shockloss.....

Gillenator already described incisions---which are easier for Doctor and staff to perform with native hair shorter--- this alone does not remove the idea of shockloss----

I believe Dr. Hasson identified the idea of manipulating existing hair--- and it is an idea that I wholly embrace--- it makes perfect sense.

When you have the potential to reduce a *negative* aspect of surgery (shockoss) and accentuate the *positive* (shaving down or shorter makes things easier and may help prevent shockloss) it is a winner in my book.

I hope this helps you guys out?

Take Care,
Jason

 

[Siberian]

Oh YAY, only 13 days post-op and the sparseness of the right temple area has definately expanded back and inward. That area was both the the thinnest to begin with, AND received the most transplants. The top of my head and left temple areas are fine, it's just the right side that's looking pretty horrid now.

I HOPE this is as bad as it gets, being a factor of it being the weakest hairs, AND the most transplants. With everyone saying it takes months to stabilize, I... worry. I realize this is supposed to be a long-term thing of hair cycles, but honest... it's already thinner in that area.

God, it's SO depressing to go through all this only to LOSE hair. Yes, I know it'll come back and be better in the end, but... just YUCK.

 

[HT55]

Oh YAY, only 13 days post-op and the sparseness of the right temple area has definately expanded back and inward. That area was both the the thinnest to begin with, AND received the most transplants. The top of my head and left temple areas are fine, it's just the right side that's looking pretty horrid now.

I HOPE this is as bad as it gets, being a factor of it being the weakest hairs, AND the most transplants. With everyone saying it takes months to stabilize, I... worry. I realize this is supposed to be a long-term thing of hair cycles, but honest... it's already thinner in that area.

God, it's SO depressing to go through all this only to LOSE hair. Yes, I know it'll come back and be better in the end, but... just YUCK.

I hate to tell you this but at 13 days you have not even entered the ugly phase.

 

[Siberian]

I hate to tell you this but at 13 days you have not even entered the ugly phase.

Which begins...?

I'm surprised this happened so soon, pretty much immediately after surgery - it just took that first normal shampooing at one week or so to notice it. Isn't shock loss supposed to occur as the hair cycles, becoming slowly but increasingly noticeable over many weeks?

I don't get why a week after surgery just one already sparse area would suddenly expand THAT much?

If I was a guy, this would certainly still be upsetting. But I wouldn't need much length to recover from it, and being a balding guy, while not much fun, is acceptable in society.

But as a woman... this is going to kill me. Sure, it'll grow back. In what? A YEAR to have a few inches of pigmented hair again? Two years to be even "normal" again? What am I supposed to do in the meantime?

I hate to admit it, but I should have left well enough alone. Oh sure, it was a bit thinned in the temples. But it wasn't THAT bad. But I got greedy. I wanted perfection. And for that, I've ruined the good thing I didn't realize I had. Yes, it's my fault. I should have done the research. In my mind, I had nothing to lose. Pay a small fortune, deal with some pain, and things would only get BETTER from surgery day forward. I hadn't planned on doing all that just to find myself set BACK for years.

 

[s.a.f]

You've got to think long term.

 

[Siberian]

You've got to think long term.

You're right, and I know it... it's just HARD, ya know? IF it doesn't get any worse, I'll be OK. Not a happy camper, but it's tolerable.

I really don't think it's the sort of "shock loss" people talk about involving long-term hair cycles. These losses most likely happened almost immediately after surgery, and just took that first real shampooing at +9 days to dislodge them. There was nothing "gradual" about this. I wash my hair for the first time post-op, find a ton of hair in the sink, and notice how thin it suddenly looks in that one area. Subsequent shampoos were normal, and it doesn't seem to be getting any worse.

Doesn't sound like what others have reported, does it?

What really surprises me (and gives me hope) is how the left side and front are perfectly fine. It's just this right side which looked awful right away, and ALSO happens to be the area that received the most grafts AND was the thinnest already.

I'm praying that means the left and front "survived" whatever trauma wiped out the right side, so this is as bad as it gets.

I guess one advantage I DO have as a female is I COULD wear a wig if I had too - it being more "acceptable" for women than men. I just HATE the idea, *especially* since I was born male. Wigs are perfectly nice on genetic women with hair problems, but it just SCREAMS "transsexual!" on someone like me. I think I'd rather be "read" as a woman (or even a TS) with a serious hair problem, then a transsexual wearing a wig...

 

[s.a.f]

Yeah although women wear wigs to get a certain style or length, you rarely see a womans wig that is'nt fake looking. Look at some of the monstrosities Britneys been wearing for the past year. I expect that a decent female wig would cost a fortune.

 

[Guest]

Bspot,

IMHO, I don't believe the combing of the hair during the procedure would have that type of effect of increasing the level of shock. In all of my studies, the related cause is definitely the trauma of the incisions regardless of the length of hair in the recipeint area. That being said, I would agree that the more existing hair is already in the recipient area, the more important it is to remove the length. Many of us tend to use the term "shave down", but again my existing was cut down with a sciccors, no electric trimmers were used. There are docs who will in fact buzz down the recipient area.

The higher the FU count or density of existing hair, the more potential for transection of that hair. That's why I still believe the issue of existing hair in the recipient area is not to transect them. Longer hair can detract or make it much more difficult to see the exact angle protrusion of the existing hair as it exits the scalp. This is absolutely critical especially if the surgeon is employing any hyyperangulation near the area. Hyper-angulated incisions can easily transect neighboring hair if the surgeon misreads the angulation of that existing hair. There are times I get pics from guys who are considering surgery yet still have a fair amount of existing hair or are going through diffusion. My recommendation is almost always to wait until more hairloss happens. Get as much bang out of what yuou already have rather than risk transection and/or permanent shockloss in the case of a more advanced diffused status.

I have also observed many many procedures where the patient had existing hair in the recipient area. Trained experienced techs don't have any problems finding the incision sites the Doctor made. They know what to look for and how to find them. Also, many of the the sites exhibit surface bleeding so actually, they are rather easy to see. Techs tend to simply gently move the existing hair aside with their finger tips rather than comb the recipient area while placing grafts. Also, the existing hair is usually wet allowing better visual of the scalp and incisions. I have never witnessed a tech having to comb existing hair to find the recipient sites. Like I said before, if there is that much existing hair in the recipient area to where the techs have to comb the hair aside to find the sites, than IMHO, the patient is having work done prematurely. That's my opinion, I am not implying anyone is doing anything wrong. Patients do vary in their goals regarding desired density levels which I recognize. But my point is that yes it may be more tedious work for the staff, but it does not increase the level of shock because the area was not first buzzed.

I guess we all possess different opinions at times, but that can be a good thing because it provides patients more information to consider.

BTW, how's your hair looking these days?

 

[s.a.f]

Gill, I've recently had a procedure (Nov) and feel that I've suffered plenty of shockloss as a result of dense packing. the affected hair in the recipient area was not my natural hair but previously transplanted hair. I've heard that natural hair sometimes does'nt grow back but transplanted hair should always come back. Is this the case?

 

[Guest]

Siberian,

A couple of things. First, try to not be too shocked that shockloss of the right temporal area occurred so quickly. That can happen. It's all in how the follicles respond to the trauma. If a fair amount of your existing hair in that right front area was diffused or near the stage of vellous hair, it is not unusual that it would shock out that quickly.

Any time I see a patient who has existing hair in the proposed recipient area, I warn them that they may look worse before things start to look better. They need to be told this upfront, and prepare for the worse, both emotionally and visually. It's just so unpredicatble. I have seen patients take the ultimate pre-op precautions, yet sometimes they still sustain a high level of shock.

Here's my recommenmdation. First try to wear a folded scarf across the top of your forehead and bring the ends back behind your neck and tie. The folded width only needfs to be 4 inches or so. I have seen many women wear this type of scarf or head band, whatever you want to call it. You still see the hair behind the scarf in front. Remeber this is a style, it does not look like you are trying to hide something. Wear it and show it like a style of choice.

Yes it's going to take time for the follicles to rest and enter their respective growing phase. Try not to be too hard on yourself while you wait. I know that's easy to say and challenging to do.

One last comment, especially for any other women who are reading this thread. DON"T LET YOUR SURGEON DO BIG SESSIONS ON YOU, AND ESPECIALLY IF YOU HAVE THINNING OR DIFFUSED HAIR. IT CAN AND MANY TIMES WILL SHOCK OUT! Many docs will want to approach female patients with gradual lower graft counts per session for this very reason. They space out the recipeint incisions and also careful as to the level of FU per cm2 achieved. The fewer incisions, the more space between them, the less trauma and resulting shock. Make sense?

 

[Guest]

S.a.f.

I read about your recent procedure, and again congrats.

Yes you are correct. Your previous tranplants can shock out from the trauma, but IT WILL GROW BACK because it's "terminal hair". The only way it would not grow back would be if some of it was transected by the new incisions.

You must be seeing some new growth by now, and I bet it looks great. You're going to look awesome as we get into summer. Best wishes to you man! :jump:

 

[Guest]

It's looking pretty good Gill--- Have to plan my 3rd one b/c my sides have fallen a bit and I want to make sure I use my donor to make everything tie in together.

Anyway, I agree that shaving totally down is not really what I mean-- A shorter cut will serve as well, IMO.

I do like the idea of shaving totally down--- I have never had an aversion to doing so b/c I am willing to trade short term for long term.

Some people cannot do so, however.

Talk to you later,
Jason

 

[Siberian]

I'm still curious... and beginning to second-guess myself about my "shock loss" problem and maybe being a BIT paranoid...

Has ANYONE heard of shock loss occurring suddenly and dramatically, like within a week of the procedure?

Has anyone lost hair for whatever reason within a week of surgery... and in one area only?

There's this temptation now whenever I look in the mirror to think, "OMG! Where'd my hair go?" on the right side of my scalp. But I seem to be forgetting that it was the balding there that got me into doing the transplant in the first place. The other side was pretty much fine. I mean it's not like it went from full density, healthy hair to nothing. Yes, it looks bad now, but it looked bad before too or I wouldn't have felt a need for the transplant.

So now that the "losses" seem to be ONLY on that side... which doesn't make much sense... I'm wondering if I'm just rediscovering the problem that was always there anyway, and freaking about "shock loss." Or at least my fears might be exaggerating the difference before/after surgery at least.

 

[s.a.f]

S.a.f.

I read about your recent procedure, and again congrats.

Yes you are correct. Your previous tranplants can shock out from the trauma, but IT WILL GROW BACK because it's "terminal hair". The only way it would not grow back would be if some of it was transected by the new incisions.

You must be seeing some new growth by now, and I bet it looks great. You're going to look awesome as we get into summer. Best wishes to you man! :jump:

Thanks, no new growth yet I'm currently 7 wks post op so I'm guessing that if the follicles resting phase is 3 months I've got at least as long to go again until it starts growing.
Transection is a worry at the back of my mind but I know Dr Feller does some seriously dense packing on guys who have the grafts available. And thats another reason for shaving down as its helps the surgeon see things more clearly when making the insiscions so I doubt that (transection) will occur.

 

[Guest]

Bspot,

Sounds like the lateral humps need a little filling in and glad you have the donor to do so. After your next procedure, you will pass me by in total graft count.

It was wise on your part to be thinking of the future and reserving donor for that. :agree:

 

[Guest]

s.a.f.

You should start seeing the new growth in another month or so. You were in good hands so don't worry too much, it will come.

 

[Guest]

Bspot,

Sounds like the lateral humps need a little filling in and glad you have the donor to do so. After your next procedure, you will pass me by in total graft count.

It was wise on your part to be thinking of the future and reserving donor for that. :agree:

Yes, I think I can do another 1000 or so strip grafts (all in the humps) and then I really don't know about fue...maybe 1000-1500 if I am lucky ---- perhaps just enough to coat the crown so I am not so damn shiny on top!!!!!

Talk to you later,
Jason

 

[Guest]

Cool!