Italian Hair Loss Lotion To Hit The Market In 2016

[abcdefg]

If you look at the past and what has actually came from the new cutting edge treatment forum you might get kind of depressed about where the future of male pattern baldness might end up. I cant think of 1 actual physical product that came out in the last 10 years filled with hundreds if not thousands of threads on similar products.
There are lists of future possible treatments, but none of them might ever come out. I dont know most companies dont seem to care about male pattern baldness for whatever reason.

 

[The 7TH Sense]

Minoxidil is giving me nightmares as a side-side-effect. I really hope FIDIA speeds up with Brotzu lotion.

 

[br1]

What still bugs me is the claim of immediate arrest in hairfall. For diffuse thinners with a decent amount of hair left, the amount of hairs in catagen and telogen that haven't been pushed out yet is really very high. I'm talking about the people that consistently see 100+ tiny hairs in the shower daily (not including the people that shower every like 4 days and then complain about how there's so much hair in the shower). I don't understand how this lotion wouldn't induce neogen on these follicles and cause a massive shed. I don't get it.

Maybe that's why you didn't invent the lotion? lol

 

[Armando Jose]

Immediated arrest of hairfall? Possibly fake
I don't buy this idea bc any treatment for hairloss MUST modify the hair loss count, generally initially increasing.

Where are photos of BEPS63?

 

[Armando Jose]

It has to fall for a new hair to grow in its place

Exactly

 

[SmoothSailing]

What I'm saying is once a follicle on your head with a hair still attached to it goes into catagen/telogen, it can't magically reattach to the follicle and continue growing. It physiologically isn't possible. It has to fall for a new hair to grow in its place.

I'm not proclaiming that the lotion does or doesn't work because of this. I'm just saying that part doesn't line up with what we understand about hair. Maybe in his personal trials he only tested on people that weren't shedders or only have slow, gradual loss, or were old enough to not have much hair left to notice any shedding. Who knows. All I'm saying is it makes no sense that there would be no initial shed because the lotion theoretically restores proper anagen/telogen ratio.

Immediated arrest of hairfall? Possibly fake
I don't buy this idea bc any treatment for hairloss MUST modify the hair loss count, generally initially increasing.

Where are photos of BEPS63?

Possibly this lotion acts in a very slow way, thus the miniaturized hair is shed but over a long period thus no increase in shedding is noticed.


Just a random guess.

 

[Armando Jose]

Another of the stupidities that I do not share is that they say that the hair thickens with the treatment !!! Any biology student knows that healthy hair keeps its thickness consistent throughout its growth phase.
To thicken a hair you need a new one and you have to remove the previous one

And also they say that in six months there are new hairs, then it is not understood that the treatment is smooth.

 

[MrJolly16]

We will never see them, but maybe I´m wrong... I hope Fidia keeps working on the lotion! But nobody knows that, because Italian people don´t talk about it in their forum, so I think we are pretty scr...

 

[ironix]

What I'm saying is once a follicle on your head with a hair still attached to it goes into catagen/telogen, it can't magically reattach to the follicle and continue growing. It physiologically isn't possible. It has to fall for a new hair to grow in its place.

I'm not proclaiming that the lotion does or doesn't work because of this. I'm just saying that part doesn't line up with what we understand about hair. Maybe in his personal trials he only tested on people that weren't shedders or only have slow, gradual loss, or were old enough to not have much hair left to notice any shedding. Who knows. All I'm saying is it makes no sense that there would be no initial shed because the lotion theoretically restores proper anagen/telogen ratio.

You assume that this lotion will have the same effect as minoxidil. Minoxidil force your hair to go faster from catagen/telogen to anagen. So all the follicles in Catagen/Telogen start to regrow faster and they push the older hair out, that's why you shed so much hair. That does not necessarily have to be the case for the lotion. If the hair in catagen/telogen will stay because the follicle doesn't get forced to go faster in a new anagen phase and rest 1-2 weeks in the catagen and 5-6 weeks in the telogen phase like they should, you won't shed more hair than normal.

What i think why you see more hair after just a few weeks is that the hairs in anagen phase will be stronger and stay longer on your head. Normaly a hair in the anagen phase stays 2-6 years on your head, but due to your Androgenetic Alopecia the anagen phase is a lot shorter and will fall out a lot faster than those 2-6 years. Since the lotion will help your hairs a lot, the hairs in the anagen phase will stay longer on your scalp and don't fall out like they used to and you will get all the new hairs which where in the late catagen phase and in the telogen phase which will grow stronger than before so basically you will have more hair which stayed in the anagen phase, no shed of the hair in the catagen phase and regrow of the hair in the telogen phase which results in more hairs after just a few weeks.

I hope i could explain my point of view, it's a bit hard for me to talk about science since english is not my native language.

*Note: I don't have inside infos about the lotion or anything. This are all assumptions and i'm just speculating based on infos we all have*

 

[Ärsond]

this @beps63 f** has completely disappeared. where is your hype train now? lmao

 

[ironix]

Another of the stupidities that I do not share is that they say that the hair thickens with the treatment !!! Any biology student knows that healthy hair keeps its thickness consistent throughout its growth phase.
To thicken a hair you need a new one and you have to remove the previous one

And also they say that in six months there are new hairs, then it is not understood that the treatment is smooth.

They never said you magically regrow 5 years of hairloss in 6 months. Beps used the final lotion over 2 years i think and he regrew 1-2 Norwoods. Brotzu aswell said you will have to use this lotion over a long period. So your hair will regrow stronger after every hair cycle and over time.

Also i don't agree with you that hairs don't thicken during a hair cycle. Beps posted a photo where some of his hair was like fuzz on top and you can see that it was stronger and darker on the bottom. I don't think the hair has to fall out just to grow stronger in the anagen(!) phase. The hair follicle will just go back to it's original state and therefore will be thicker and stronger and just build stronger hair on the bottom. Over time the hair in the anagen phase will grow stronger and thicker every week and build up the hair like a pyramide (you know thin on top, big on the bottom).

 

[ironix]

Sure, but even assuming it doesn't force phase change like minoxidil: If telogen phase lasts ~3 months where the han falls out, and the lotion restores proper anagen duration, then wouldn't it mean there'd still have to be a 3 month window of telogen phase follicles that would still shed as if you were never using the lotion? I just don't see how it can stop hairfall in 1 week if there's still that 3 month window of male pattern baldness-ratio telogen follicles behaving the same way they would with or without the lotion.

So like if you shed 300 hairs today. Let's assume that means 300 other follicles entered telogen today as well. Next day, you start the lotion that restores anagen duration. You shed 300, but only 100 other follicles enter telogen. You'd still shed the same amount for the next 3 months as you have since your male pattern baldness started before the effects of the lotion kick in regarding shedding.

First of all on the patent they said its a reduction of hair fall after 1 week and a stop of hair loss after 3 weeks.

The hairs which are in the telogen phase will most likely fall out because i don't think they will attach to the follicle again. So if 300 hairs entered telogen before you started the lotion, this hair will fall out but they will also regrow again. After you start using the lotion the hair cycle should be more stable and less and less hair will enter catagen and telogen phase and hairs stay longer in the anagen phase, so you should start to see a reduction of hair loss after just a few days/weeks and later on a stop. I doupt that you stop losing hair after just 20 days because like you said you will have more telogen and catagen hairs than a person without Androgenetic Alopecia at the beginning and they will fall out and you still lose maybe 150 hairs a day. I don't think brotzu counted hairs in his trails for the patent and his statements are based on the feedback of the participants and if i would lose 150 hairs instead of 300 hairs a day after just 20 days it would feel like a stop of hair loss for me even if it's not a stop in a scientific way.

 

[Xander94]

Here we go again, "the patent says", "beps said" can we just let this thread die and just post memes until we hear from Fidia again?

 

[worm]

Here we go again, "the patent says", "beps said" can we just let this thread die and just post memes until we hear from Fidia again?

Second that! Keep the memes coming, but seeing the same speculations page after page on a loop will not make the lotion any more real of effective. We just need to wait and see.

 

[whoken]

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[sunchyme1]

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my f*****g nw7 horseshoe isnt even thick enough to pull this look off anymore. lucky bastard

 

[ironix]

I think you understand what I'm trying to say, but are kind of casually skewing it to seem like less of a deal. Not that I'm saying it is a big deal to begin with.

If you are consistently shedding 300 hairs per day for 1 year, you can safely assume that every day around 300 hairs are entering catagen->telogen. So if telogen phase lasts 3 months, you can safely assume at any point in that timeline, you will continue to shed 300 hairs per day for the next 3 months guaranteed, since no product can affect the behavior or duration of the telogen phase (excluding minoxidil, under the assumption that it abruptly stops telogen and immediately induces anagen).

The only thing I can think of that goes against this timeline is the fact that transplanted hair sheds 1-5 weeks after a transplant, not 3 months. I don't know the science behind how a follicle behaves phase-wise after it's extracted and then transplanted, but regardless, it means that for normal anagen of the transplanted follicles to occur, a shed has to happen. So I don't know. I just am thrown by the claims. I understand that the data is just what the participants are claiming, which can be wrong, but I just really can't imagine how it can stop all hairfall even after 20 days like it says in the patent.

Not that it's all gloom and doom. Like I said, it could be that the people trialed weren't big shedders to begin with. Maybe the strengthening the lotion does on the current anagen follicles, which I believe can happen as quickly as claimed, made them tunnel vision on how good their hair feels and ignore the naturally high amount of shed they're still having. Who knows, I'm just trying to form conclusions based on the logic of what we already know about how hair works. Considering this lotion supposedly doesn't change anything about what we already know about the hair cycle, I was just curious about this detail that goes against the current understanding.

We have too less informations about the lotion now to answer this question in detail. Brotzu said there was no shed so your assumption that you would still lose those 300 hairs a day over 3 months would make sense because I really don't think that those hair will attach to the follicle again, so they have to fall out. Also i think transplanted hair sheds because of the stress during the transplantation and not because of a hair cycle. So the hair are anagen hairs which just shed because of the operation and they don't naturally enter catagen and telogen phase and therefore don't stay 3 months on your haid before they fall out. I think they behave more like a plucked hair and the hair follicle itself is still in the anagen phase.
All in all I don't like the informations in the patent because there are not a lot of facts. First of all there where just 6 mens which tested the lotion so a really insignificant number, there is no before and after hair count and just feedbacks and visually observations by the doctor and the participants which is not a very scientific way to collect hard facts and also we don't know what hairloss those 6 men had. Was it Androgenetic Alopecia or just a thining of hairloss because of a bad diet or whatever.. Overall I don't think we should give too much about those times stated in the patent because the way brotzu made this trail is a bit by rule of thumb. Important is, that there where positive results after 120 days and everything else will be answered in the near future.

 

[ironix]

Also to all those which are mad because this thread does not die and people still discuss about the lotion. This was one of the more interesting questions over the last 200 pages and was really refreshing after all those "should-I-start-minoxidil" questions and "we-should-email-fidia"-people who tired to be funny (except those memes, i love it! keep going with them). In the end it's still a hairloss forum which is here to talk about hairloss, the science of hairloss and future treatments and i prefere to bridge the time until fidia will release some results with some interesting discussions about the lotion or hairloss than to smash my head on the desk because of so much bullshit. If you don't like it, then you should probabely just refresh the homepage of fidia, because if there are official news, they will post it there first.

 

[mr_robot]

The problem with this thread is it is based completely on speculation, there has been no evidence for anything that has been said. A patent can claim anything it wants it does not have to be true, just look at the patents for previous hair loss "cures".

As such this thread should really be under a "Gossip" section, because that is basically what it is. Unfortunately it seems some people cant distinguish between gossip and truth.

 

[ironix]

True! I know it's a lot of bullshit and speculation but keep in mind this forum does also help people dealing with their hairloss. For me it's "nice" to see that other people are in the same situation like i am right now and that many of the feel the same way i do and deal with the same rollercoaster everyday and everyone here does wait every day for the news that a cure is finally here and we can all go on with our lives without hairloss. For me this thread is more than just speculations about a lotion, it's about us all which share our emotions about our hairloss and give us the feeling that we are not alone in the world with this problem, unfortunately this does mean that we talk a lot about bullshit and speculations and sure, maybe there where too much speculation in this thread and the hype was just too much but at the moment all those speculations why this lotion is so awesome give me hope and make me look more optimistic in the future and thats all what counts right now.