Minoxidil: What to expect?

[moonbase]

Hey,

I am sure these questions have been asked time, and time again but, I was hoping someone might take a second to answer.

I'm starting minoxidil for the first time. I have sensitive skin and a lot of "normal" products will irritate me. I purchased MinoxidilMax's 5% min (no PG) and 5% Min + 5% AA (no PG). I applied some to my arm and I got a weird sensation.. like it was swelling/tingling but there was no visible swelling/redness. What should I expect when applying minoxidil, does it have a particular sensation or feeling?

My Second question would be, how long can I hope minoxidil will keep working.. Hairloss aside, how fast do hairs become used to minoxidil? (personal experience would be great here).

Thanks all!

 

[Bryan]

My Second question would be, how long can I hope minoxidil will keep working.. Hairloss aside, how fast do hairs become used to minoxidil?

I've read a pile of topical minoxidil studies over the years, and I'm not really aware of any scientific evidence that hair follicles become "used to" minoxidil, in the way that I know you mean. The best available evidence, in my opinion, suggests that while topical minoxidil stimulates extra hair growth, it doesn't actually interfere with the fundamental balding process; because of that, balding continues at about the same general rate, although it does give you that extra "offset of growth" at the beginning, thanks to the minoxidil. Once that "offset of growth" is eventually overtaken and surpassed by your own natural rate of balding, you'll be back to about your original starting position, which could be anywhere from several months to a few years later.

Because of what I said before, I strongly recommend against using topical minoxidil alone, because it doesn't seem to interfere with the fundamental balding process. Always use it along with something else which _does_ do that; one obvious example would be Propecia.

 

[Rocky V]

hey bryan,

what other anti androgen would you recommend to use with topical minoxidil other than propecia? will revivogen or topical spironolactone be effective with minoxidil too? which do you consider as more potent: revivogen, topical spironolactone, keto cream, or alezaic acid alongside minoxidil?

 

[Bryan]

what other anti androgen would you recommend to use with topical minoxidil other than propecia?

Finasteride and dutasteride aren't "antiandrogens" at all, they're just 5a-reductase inhibitors.

will revivogen or topical spironolactone be effective with minoxidil too? which do you consider as more potent: revivogen, topical spironolactone, keto cream, or alezaic acid alongside minoxidil?

Revivogen always seems to be controversial on hairloss sites, of course, but I imagine it works at least to _some_ degree.

So does topical spironolactone, although it's not as effective as topical RU58841 (there are separate problems with RU58841, of course: shady sources of availability, and extreme cost).

I'm not sure about the use of keto cream; there's no real medical evidence that the use of topical azelaic acid has any kind of effect as a 5a-reductase inhibitor in vivo.

I think over-the-counter Prox-N would be a good product to use with topical minoxidil, especially considering the more recent additions to its formula (TEMPO/TEMPOL and PBN). There continues to be a bit of a debate over whether or not Prox-N really interferes with the fundamental balding process, but I certainly don't think it's entirely out of the question that it does.

 

[moonbase]

Hey Bryan,

Thanks for the reply. In regards to Prox-N. I am wondering how exactly it works to inhibit the binding of DHT to the follicle and or interrupting the 5AR-type 1 in the skin? I can see that the SOD, and CP's will de-calcify tissue, and support grown respectively but, how does it work on androgen's? Do you have personal experience that suggests it blocks androgen's in some way?

I have been using folligen/hair signals and it does have an anti androgenic effect (hair doesn't produce sebum for a day or so if I skip an application), likely through the saw palmetto and other extracts inhibiting T/DHT from binding to the receptor site.

With that said, i'm not about to bet the house on saw palmetto, and I'd like to increase my firepower with another product.

 

[Bryan]

Thanks for the reply. In regards to Prox-N. I am wondering how exactly it works to inhibit the binding of DHT to the follicle and or interrupting the 5AR-type 1 in the skin? I can see that the SOD, and CP's will de-calcify tissue, and support grown respectively but, how does it work on androgen's?

I don't know that the over-the-counter Prox-N even has any effect at all on androgens. It seems to work entirely by stimulating SOD through the activity of copper-peptides, and the aforementioned TEMPO/TEMPOL and PBN (I call those last ones "turbocharged SODs" ). It also has a hairgrowth stimulant called "NANO", which apparently works in a way that's somewhat similar to minoxidil. It has other substances, too, which I won't attempt to elaborate on. The ones I've mentioned already are the most important ones.

Do you have personal experience that suggests it blocks androgen's in some way?

I don't have any reason to think it acts against androgens in any way, but I've used Prox-N successfully in the past. I've used it all by itself in the past, several years ago, without anything else (no finasteride, no minoxidil), and it was able to MORE than maintain my hair for a period of two full years. I have the before-and-after pictures to prove it. Furthermore, that was back in the days BEFORE Dr. Proctor had added TEMPO/TEMPOL and PBN to the formula. I consider those ingredients to be especially important.

I have been using folligen/hair signals and it does have an anti androgenic effect (hair doesn't produce sebum for a day or so if I skip an application), likely through the saw palmetto and other extracts inhibiting T/DHT from binding to the receptor site.

With that said, i'm not about to bet the house on saw palmetto, and I'd like to increase my firepower with another product.

In that case, adding those two products (Folligen and Hair Signals) to topical minoxidil usage _may_ be sufficient to interfere with the fundamental balding process, as I suggested doing in my earlier post.

 

[moonbase]

Thanks for the response. Prox-N does sound quite promising, especially the SOD's. If you could PM those before and after photo's i'd be grateful. It's always nice to see what progress people get.

For the next 6 months i'm going to be working strictly from home and have no other engagements... So I don't mind looking like a science project all day. Let the hair growth begin!!

Morning:
Shampoo??
Prox-N (Folligen/HairSignals till it arrives)
minoxidil 5% + 5% AA
Emu Oil

Night:
Shampoo??
Folligen/HairSignals
minoxidil 5% + 5% AA
Emu Oil

If anyone has any suggestions on a good quality shampoo that doesn't overly strip the hair and may help my hairloss with additional ingredients, i'm all ears!

UPDATE:

Currently looking at the following:
Regenepure:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...17145&creative=399369&creativeASIN=B0032FSDOA
Revita:
http://www.amazon.com/DS-Laboratori...sr_1_5?s=beauty&ie=UTF8&qid=1310941155&sr=1-5
Revivogen:
http://www.amazon.com/Revivogen-Bio...sr_1_1?s=beauty&ie=UTF8&qid=1310941220&sr=1-1

 

[Rocky V]

thanks bryan for the info.

so will prox-n be effective in conjunction with minoxidil for daily use? if it does interfere with the effectiveness of minoxidil then would it be ok to try minoxidil in the mornings and prox-n in the evenings?

also, why did you stop prox-n? did the effectiveness stop after two years?

finally, how does generic prox-n compare with regular prox-n? do you think its as effective?

thanks

 

[moonbase]

Today was my first application of minoxidil and I must say, not nearly as bad as I imagined. Infact, I actually like the way it makes my hair look.

 

[Jacob]

And I see Bryan is back to the Prox pushing.

Turbo-SOD...why not just use liposomal SOD? :shock: