Permanent hyperandrogenism after stopping Finasteride

[Baylad]

Oral medication will always have increased risks over topical application, need to way up benefits.

 

[SayifDoit]

That's sound terrible. You have one choice either accept the situation and hope in the future it will eventually stop. By the way I recommend shaving your head and having freezing cold showers every night almost painful, perhaps start using nizoral every three days.

Next thing you can do and I don't even recommend doing it. I am no way a doctor fyi. But maybe get back on finasteride and if does nothing, then start experimenting with all the crazy hormone altering drugs out there. I don't recommend that.

You really need to see a derm, dude you can't live like that.

 

[bilboswaggins]

You really need to see a derm, dude you can't live like that.

derms are 100% useless when it comes to stuff like this. my derm told me it is impossible for finasteride to cause shedding

 

[Dench57]

That's sound terrible. You have one choice either accept the situation and hope in the future it will eventually stop. By the way I recommend shaving your head and having freezing cold showers every night almost painful, perhaps start using nizoral every three days.

Next thing you can do and I don't even recommend doing it. I am no way a doctor fyi. But maybe get back on finasteride and if does nothing, then start experimenting with all the crazy hormone altering drugs out there. I don't recommend that.

You really need to see a derm, dude you can't live like that.

I am trying to accept the situation but it's impossible when the pain is this bad, constantly. I am praying that it will one day resolve itself naturally, but after 6 months+ off finasteride, it's only getting worse, and progressing to other areas of my head. I see threads like this: http://abchomeopathy.com/forum2.php/40135/ where a guy used Propecia for 1 month, and still has burning/itching scalp pain 2.5 years after quitting. It really hits home that I've potentially ruined my life and will be fighting this forever....

Even if I shaved my hair off I would still have the itching/burning - it's happening in the hair follicle which would still be present in a shaved head. I've tried having freezing cold showers and do use keto shampoo once every 3 days.

I have toyed with the idea of using finasteride again, using the logic that less DHT = less inflammation in the hair follicles. But finasteride CAUSED this to happen, I never had it before finasteride, so using it again I'd just have the same reaction. I never want to touch that **** again after what it's done to me.

I have seen a derm but they were useless - basically said I had atypical pain syndrome because Androgenetic Alopecia cannot cause itching/burning, when from all the stuff I see online it's clear inflammation does play a part in Androgenetic Alopecia, and when it's extremely bad it manifests itself as burning/itching pain.

I am going to Harley Street in London to see a specialist in Androgenetic Alopecia. If they can't help me, nobody can. I don't have high hopes, the doctors I've seen so far don't have a clue...I've been researching this everyday for 8 months now and trying everything in my power, but nothing has remotely helped.

I took Propecia as a preventative measure, I was aware of the sexual side effects but there was no mention of this hell....I was NW1 with complete thickness, in hindsight a near-perfect head of hair. Now everyday I live with this burning and itching all over my head, knowing that by taking a pill supposed to help with male pattern baldness, I've unleashed the most aggressive and painful male pattern baldness imaginable. Not even a hair transplant can save me because it's so aggressive.

- - - Updated - - -

Should also state that I still have increased sebum production, increased libido. Pretty sure finasteride just made me hypersensitive to DHT (great job!). I have just been to have an extensive blood test done so I will report back with DHT levels. I think they'll be within normal range because afaik finasteride doesn't permanently alter hormone levels - but it can permanently alter your sensitivity (androgen receptors) to those hormones.

None of the other symptoms even compare to the scalp pain/itching though.

 

[Dench57]

If you were born in 1957 that puts you at around 58. A man peaks in testosterone at 17-23 so lets say you have 500ng of testosterone in your youth. By the time you hit 40 your testosterone production is halved of what it was when you are young so at 40 you would be at 250ng on the low end of acceptable testosterone for men. As one keeps on aging your testosterone production keeps declining and declining. I am sorry but your has way more to do with your ED than Finasteride, but I don't see anything wrong with you not taking it since you are already an older male so you don't really NEED hair as much as a guy that is in his teens/early twenties. With that being said at the end of the day people are gonna do what they will with their bodies. However IMO, if you are young and balding fast I would strongly encourage you to get on finasteride and forget about the sides.

I'm not sure if you're confused or just didn't read my post.

I'm 25 years old. I've never experienced ED from Finasteride, quite the opposite (stronger erections and increased sex drive). finasteride seems to have permanently accelerated my male pattern baldness by making me hypersensitive to DHT though.

 

[nohawk]

I'm not sure if you're confused or just didn't read my post.

I'm 25 years old. I've never experienced ED from Finasteride, quite the opposite (stronger erections and increased sex drive). finasteride seems to have permanently accelerated my male pattern baldness by making me hypersensitive to DHT though.

I started finasteride at 21 and took it for 3 years. Was hornier for the first year, then it started to slowly decline while I also experienced ball ache. By the end of 3rd year I couldn't have sex with my girlfriend and broke up with her so I could deal with this on my own. 4 years have passed and I am able to get an erection and feel about 70% recovered. For the extra 30%, I'll pop a v**** and forget about it.

Point is, (for me at least) the devastating effects of finasteride are slow, gradual, and you won't know what hit you until it's too late. I guess for some people, having an adverse reaction to their 2nd or 3rd pill is possible, but you won't really know if you have screwed your body up until 3-4 years down the line. Just cause you take finasteride and you are horny doesn't mean finasteride is having positive effects on you LOL..... what it means is that you're a responder, look forward to great hair, and 4-5 years of hypogonadism.

 

[Dench57]

Point is, (for me at least) the devastating effects of finasteride are slow, gradual, and you won't know what hit you until it's too late. I guess for some people, having an adverse reaction to their 2nd or 3rd pill is possible, but you won't really know if you have screwed your body up until 3-4 years down the line. Just cause you take finasteride and you are horny doesn't mean finasteride is having positive effects on you LOL..... what it means is that you're a responder, look forward to great hair, and 4-5 years of hypogonadism.

I felt the scalp pain/itch within 3 weeks of starting finasteride, which is what a lot of people report with reflex-hyper, that it happens almost immediately. I should've stopped then but everybody advised me to ride it out, and stupidly I did. I'll never know if that "riding out" period of 2 months has made this permanent, or whether I was screwed as soon as I felt the first itch.

And yes from what I've read hypo-gonadal symptoms usually = good results for hair and hyper-gonadal = bad for hair.

 

[jackakastones]

Hey Dench,

How are you doing man? Any relief or change in your situation?

 

[Dench57]

Hey Dench,

How are you doing man? Any relief or change in your situation?

Wow, I forgot all about this thread. No my situation is unchanged. Still 24/7 burning/itching all along my hairline and frontal scalp. Something I just have to learn to live with now. I don't think upregulation in the scalp is even proven but I don't know what else could've happened. 3 years of balding with no itch whatsoever, then took Propecia and within 3 weeks the itching/burning began.

I posted "I am considering taking internal anti-androgens like spironolactone or Flutamide" in the OP. LOL was I retarded. A lot changes in such a short time. Thankfully I never took those. I don't think I'm "hyperandrogenic", the oiliness/acne/increased libido have subsided in recent months, but the scalp inflammation/accelerated loss will probably be permanent seen as it's basically just aggressive male pattern baldness.

 

[Agustin Araujo]

Dench57, I am sorry about your experience with Finasteride. There's absolutely no doubt you had a really nasty experience with it, and are still going through it. It is in fact true that any medication can cause adverse side effects. With the 5-alpha-reductase inhibitors, a possible side effect they can cause is in fact hair loss! Though it's usually so uncommon, most of us who use Dutasteride or Finasteride with zero problems have a hard time believing claims like that. From reading about your experience with Finasteride, it is quite genuine. And I'll admit that it's absolutely grotesque how there's minimal/no information on how to treat the constant itching. There has got to be something out there that'll help with the situation you're in. I'd keep looking for something on how to manage with what your going through, despite that you haven't been very successful due to the lack of information available.

Me personally, my Androgenetic Alopecia itch has practically subsided completely since getting on treatment. However, someone like my self who's also gone through the debilitating itch, I know this stuff is hard to deal with. If I were you, I'd use powerful anti-inflammatory products which contain tea tree oil, emu oil, aloe vera, peppermint oil, compounds like those despite that they won't help treat male pattern baldness itself. I use products like those myself and they are soothing to my scalp. And I'm not aware if you've used one or not, but I'd start using a Ketoconazole shampoo, preferably a 1% concentration like Lipogaine Big 3 Shampoo or Regenepure DR. I would avoid the 2% Ketoconazole shampoos since they're overly drying to the scalp, and also won't make your hair look good.

Now, I'm not sure if you'll be comfortable with what I'm about to tell you or not, and I'm also not aware if you've used it or not: If I were you, I would look into an experimental anti-androgen for topical use only called RU58841. It is a powerful androgen receptor antagonist, and it powerfully competes with DHT, keeping the androgen from binding to the androgen receptor. RU58841 itself should give a tremendous relieve from the debilitating itch you've been going through along with the compound helping to treat your Male Pattern Baldness.

Other than that, so far, that's as much as I can help you. Let me know if you have any questions.

 

[jackakastones]

Sorry to hear that Dench. I hope you find something to at least rid you of the itch. Are you thinking about trialing setipiprant if others start seeing some results?

 

[Dench57]

Text

Thanks for the comments Agustin. Its a pretty terrible experience to have inflicted this oily/itchiness on myself as I'm sure you can imagine. male pattern baldness is bad enough but male pattern baldness with the inflammation is on a different level completely. I've tried all the essential oils, anti-inflammatory/medicated shampoos, corticosteroids etc. No relief unfortunately. I use Regenepure DR 3-4 times a week, it helps a little bit. It's clear this needs to be hit with treatment that directly acts on the Androgenetic Alopecia inflammation pathway. Obviously my options are limited given my intolerance to 5ARi's so that leaves CRTH2 inhibitors and topical AAs. I'm in a group buy for Setipiprant at the moment and am hopeful it will significantly reduce my inflammation - all other early users have reported reduction/cessation of itching. I have considered RU but have been holding off on topical AAs given they are a pretty big commitment. I also potentially risk the same adverse reaction I had to finasteride (upregulation?)and am also wary of the sides from RU since I think I'm sensitive to androgen changes. Having said that I'm in a group buy for CB-03-01 which I'll have on standby should Seti not be enough.

Sorry to hear that Dench. I hope you find something to at least rid you of the itch. Are you thinking about trialing setipiprant if others start seeing some results?

I'm in the second Setipiprant group buy, should have it within the next 2 months, and will report here with my experiences.

 

[Agustin Araujo]

Thanks for the comments Agustin. Its a pretty terrible experience to have inflicted this oily/itchiness on myself as I'm sure you can imagine. male pattern baldness is bad enough but male pattern baldness with the inflammation is on a different level completely. I've tried all the essential oils, anti-inflammatory/medicated shampoos, corticosteroids etc. No relief unfortunately. I use Regenepure DR 3-4 times a week, it helps a little bit. It's clear this needs to be hit with treatment that directly acts on the Androgenetic Alopecia inflammation pathway. Obviously my options are limited given my intolerance to 5ARi's so that leaves CRTH2 inhibitors and topical AAs. I'm in a group buy for Setipiprant at the moment and am hopeful it will significantly reduce my inflammation - all other early users have reported reduction/cessation of itching. I have considered RU but have been holding off on topical AAs given they are a pretty big commitment. I also potentially risk the same adverse reaction I had to finasteride (upregulation?)and am also wary of the sides from RU since I think I'm sensitive to androgen changes. Having said that I'm in a group buy for CB-03-01 which I'll have on standby should Seti not be enough.

Besides going through the constant debilitating itch, I also went through the intense inflammation and excessive oil/sebum production on my scalp. Hopefully you'll be relieved of this burden since it's a situation so hard to go through in the long term. Perhaps using topical anti-androgens many be your best chance to deal with your aggressive male pattern baldness along with using Setipiprant if it really does truly prove to treat hair loss potently and the inflammation related to it. Let's hope CB-03-01 and Setipiprant will help you out a lot with what you're dealing with.

 

[mitch1211]

You guys are ****ing crazy.... lol at claiming 2 pills permanantly ****ed you up.... lol at the guy who said finasteride have him tinnitus...
You know insane you idiots sound?

 

[Francisiii]

Really? That Riverwalk in San Antonio has got you spun. This is serious and I am extremely thankful that Dench has expressed and has continued to convey his struggles with this.

 

[myhairbegone]

That sucks man. I feel for you.. I had male pattern baldness itch bad and getting on finasteride and regenpure relived it. I cant image having it constantly for years and not getting help from doctors/medicine.

Maybe try meditation? It can help where western medicine fails. I know "meditation to stop an itchy scalp" sounds crazy, but you might be suprised, give it a shot.

Best of luck brotha

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

A lot of people on propeciahelp forums seem to heal via a long-term water fast (e.g. 21 days). Have you tried that?

 

[Agustin Araujo]

Dench57, any update with your hair and the scalp itching? :tellme:

 

[Dench57]

I wish I could change the title of this thread because I don't have "hyperandrogenism" lol. The increased oiliness/libido/acne/energy dissipated within a few months of stopping finasteride. Or maybe it was cos I introduced keto shampoo/acne wipes.

You guys are ****ing crazy.... lol at claiming 2 pills permanantly ****ed you up.... lol at the guy who said finasteride have him tinnitus...
You know insane you idiots sound?

Not sure who this is aimed at. I was taking finasteride for 3 months. Didn't encounter any of the normal sides, or tinnitus, just burning scalp. I also can't prove finasteride caused it but I'm 99% sure since I was balding for 2 years before finasteride without the slightest itch. And I also get people PM'ing regularly experiencing similar reactions when they use it.

That sucks man. I feel for you.. I had male pattern baldness itch bad and getting on finasteride and regenpure relived it. I cant image having it constantly for years and not getting help from doctors/medicine.

Maybe try meditation? It can help where western medicine fails. I know "meditation to stop an itchy scalp" sounds crazy, but you might be suprised, give it a shot.

Best of luck brotha

I should probably try this. I should say, the itchiness I can handle, but the burning pain/soreness is the real kicker. One of my best friend does regular meditation. It might be useful to try and escape the scalp discomfort even temporarily, in a "mind over matter" sort of way.

A lot of people on propeciahelp forums seem to heal via a long-term water fast (e.g. 21 days). Have you tried that?

Would this work for my situation? I know the vast majority of people on PropeciaHelp have PFS which I don't have. I've tried anti-inflammatory/low GCI diets to no avail.

Dench57, any update with your hair and the scalp itching? :tellme:

Hey Agustin, I've exhausted every possible hairloss treatment including CRTH2 antagonists and topical AAs, so I've pretty much given up on the hair front, my only priority is reducing this scalp ****. The most powerful anti-inflammatory meds (topical, or orals like indomethacin and prednisone) aren't much help. I'm currently on dutasteride+RU. Probably the only person dumb enough to try dutasteride after getting Androgenetic Alopecia inflammation from finasteride but I'm out of ideas and hoping maybe I'll respond to it differently. Its been nearly 2 months now, hasn't got worse but also hasn't got any better, so I'll give it more time. I'm also getting a scalp biopsy done in a few weeks and honestly praying that I have some weird scarring/folliculitis/lichen or other scalp condition, but I'm pretty sure its just Androgenetic Alopecia. I think I remember reading an old post of yours where I think it took about 1 month for dutasteride to reduce your inflammation? Or was it pretty instant?

 

[abcdefg]

If your trying dutasteride just come back in like a year and see if its better. Its pointless posting every few days or weeks. male pattern baldness is measured in like 6 month or year intervals. Its a very very slow thing you cant even think about it until enough time passes. One month results are meaningless.