Propecia

[RalphyWiggum]

Ralphy, since I already recieved a pretty good deal from my neighbor pharmacist on Propecia, I am going to use my first month supply up and then consider Proscar. Explain your results in a detailed way if possible. I am aware that you haven't experienced any side effects which is a breakthrough all on it's own. Now what possitive effects have you underwent? (Hair loss stoppage, regrowth, better hair quality, etc...)

Hear from you soon Ralphy...

I've seen thickening and stregthing of my hair and I've seen my temples and hairline stablize and move forward a little. Most importantly I've maintained and since I'm only a NW1.5 I can be happy with that alone.

 

[X190]

Shedding

I have a strange kind of shedding. (Or at least it seems that way for me.) As I analize the hairs that fall, some have white, healthy-looking bulbs, and some have black, burnt-looking bulbs. Anybody has any explanation on the difference between these two? (One is a DHT affected hair, the other is a regular dormant shed hair, etc...) In my opinion the black bulb hairs are from DHT affected follicles but can anybody explain this? Thanks...

 

[MrTelogen]

Hey RW from what I understand, hyperandrogecity is when it ( super sheds) does not stop after a few weeks. If it stops does that not mean it isn't hyperandrogecity after all?

 

[RalphyWiggum]

From Proctor

"Reflex hyperandrogenicity" is the reflex increase in testosterone
(and possibly androgen sensitivity) that accompanies the use of antiandrogens.
Normally it is not expressed clinically, except that it limits the use of
antiandrogens in uncastrated males fortreating metastatic prostate cancer.

I was apparently the first to observe it with finasteride--- or at
least figure out what was going on ( he says modestly ). But it has since
been involked by other researchers to explain the apparent ability of
Finasteride to "promote" the last stage of Prostate cancer.

In the case of finasteride, where only certain tissues are
"protected", reflex hyperandrogenicity may occasionally express itself
clinically as things like acne flares, increased libido, etc.. This affects
tissues that are not dependent on type-2 5-AT, which finasteride works by
inhibiting. The good part is that it may minimize such side-effedcts as
libido decrease.

He is the real kicker....

Symptoms of putative reflex hyperandrogenicity from finasteride:
acne flares, increased libido, increased skin oiliness, increased body
hair (?). With the exception of hair loss, these are roughly the same as
the symptoms of excess testosterone. BTW, as long as these symptoms are
absent, you probably don't have to worry about finasteride making baldness
worse.

But in any case, I thought reflex hyperandrogenicity exacerbating
balding unlikely in the absence of "other" hyperandrogenic symptoms. This is
because other tissues are more sensitive to androgens than hair follicles,
which are relatively "protected" by finasteride. I.e., if the more
sensitive tissues are not having a hyperandrogenic reaction, then less
sensitive tissues such as hair follicles in the presence of finasteride
probably aren't either.

Here's a good comment from Bryan...

I think that's an excellent point. I think when some people perceive what
they consider to be some kind of decline in the performance of Propecia
(whether that's accurate or not), they're too quick to blame it on that
buzz-word concept of a "hyperandrogenic response". I don't buy it.

Bryan

I hope this clears things up

 

[MrTelogen]

Wow, thanks!

 

[getting_impatient!!!]

only been 4 months, but....

I am getting worried, though reading this site has made me relax a little now knowing more about hair loss issues.

I am 25. Started to notice hair thinning at about 22 or 23. Always had full thick hair. Brother told me that the crown was thinning and I should look at Rogaine. I used it for about 5 months, but started getting this itching and flaking. I decided to stop using it because of the flaking and now I have a significant amount of hair in the drain after every shower. I guess the usual indications....pillow, brush, bathroom floor.

Went to see a doctor, and she put me on Propecia. I am about to finish up with month 4 and I see nothing. I even complimented it with Rogaine again and started to get the itching and flaking, but this time the itching is much worse. The flaking is about the same. I am still seeing a good amount of hair in the drain too.


Questions:
Is it normal to still have hair loss at 4 months with propecia? Is this the "shedding" that I keep reading about?

What is the best combination? Should I keep taking Propecia and buy the Nizoral for the scalp irritation? Will the Nizoral keep the Rogaine from flaking?

Will Nizoral help regrow hair? Is it prescription only?

I know propecia stops hair from falling out and sometimes regrows hair. Do I have to keep using Rogaine if I want regrowth? SO Confused!!!!!!


Sorry for so many questions, but these have been on my mind since I started propecia. Reading about all of it just makes it jumble in my head! I guess I am hoping someone can put it back into perspective.

Thanks in advance,
Terry

 

[getting_impatient!!!]

Summary

I guess to make my first post shorter,

How can I stop the hair loss, regrow some hair, and keep it from itching and flaking?

My doctor never said anything about also using something to regrow. She seemed to think that propecia did that. She also never said anything about Nizoral (or related products) to ensure healthy scalp and hair.


Oh, I have noticed the same thing as xzellerate stated in his above post:

I have a strange kind of shedding. (Or at least it seems that way for me.) As I analize the hairs that fall, some have white, healthy-looking bulbs, and some have black, burnt-looking bulbs. Anybody has any explanation on the difference between these two? (One is a DHT affected hair, the other is a regular dormant shed hair, etc...) In my opinion the black bulb hairs are from DHT affected follicles but can anybody explain this? Thanks...

 

[GourmetStyleWellness]

Re: only been 4 months, but....

I am getting worried, though reading this site has made me relax a little now knowing more about hair loss issues.

Education on a topic always helps disspell fears about it. Im glad the site has helped.

Brother told me that the crown was thinning and I should look at Rogaine.

Everyone says Rogaine at the drop of a hat, typically because its all most people know about. This is because Rogaine has been much more heavily marketed, even though Propecia is far more effective at obtaining the goal that people who've just begun to thin are seeking.

Went to see a doctor, and she put me on Propecia.

Wow, an educated doctor. Im speechless

I am about to finish up with month 4 and I see nothing.

Looks like your educated Doctor forgot to mention the most important thing: Propecia takes time. Minimum 6 months, sometimes a full year, before you stop seeing hair loss. 4 months is insufficient time.

I even complimented it with Rogaine again and started to get the itching and flaking, but this time the itching is much worse.

The flaking is likely worse because your Doctor likely also forgot (or had no idea) to mention that you should be using Nizoral shampoo along with your Propecia regimen. An anti inflammation / dandruff shampoo was required of all Propecia trial participants. Sometimes I wonder why Propecia isn't sold with a bottle of this shampoo. Without it you will likely NOT see the same results. More confusing things in the world of medicine I guess.

Is it normal to still have hair loss at 4 months with propecia? Is this the "shedding" that I keep reading about?

To the first question, yes. I shed for a full four months before I saw it even begin to slow. Some shed for 12 months before they see it slow and stop. To the second question: its impossible to answer. There is no "Is this shedding or something else" meter we could attach to your head, and the appearance of the bulbs is irrelevant unfortunately. The most I can say is "yes its very likely". What you're seeing is very common.

What is the best combination?

For hair maintenance, if you're using Nizoral along with it, Propecia should be 100% sufficient. I would save the rogaine for when you really need to regrow new hair. There's absolutely no reason to use Rogaine *and* Propecia for someone who has a full head of hair that is beginning to thin, unless you find after 6-12 months that the Propecia isn't working. Then add Rogaine. Make sure you use Nizoral shampoo (grocery store shampoo aisle by the rogaine) once every 3 days, and let it soak while you shower.

Should I keep taking Propecia and buy the Nizoral for the scalp irritation? Will the Nizoral keep the Rogaine from flaking?

To the first question, yes. To the second question, I'd say hold off on the Rogaine entirely for now. You're only 25. You need to maintain your hair for at least another 40 years. Pace yourself. If Propecia works alone, save Rogaine for 7 years down the road when its effectiveness begins to decline. Use the Rogaine and Propecia now and you potentially use up your two biggest options all in the first 5 years. Then what will you do? Hope something new comes out in that time

Will Nizoral help regrow hair? Is it prescription only?

Non prescription strength is all most need and its in the grocery store, blue box, next to rogaine in shampoo aisle. 2% prescrip version is available in various places online for those who have tried the regular for 3-6 months and not seen cessation of inflammation.

I know propecia stops hair from falling out and sometimes regrows hair. Do I have to keep using Rogaine if I want regrowth? SO Confused!!!!!!

Yes, anything you stimulate into growth on Rogaine lives solely because of Rogaine. Anything you maintain because of Propecia, is maintained only via Propecia. Rogaine only bypasses the cause of hair loss. Propecia stops it. Much more intelligent solution.

Your biggest challenge is going to be not looking in the mirror for the next 8 months. If you still have a FULL head of hair that is just thinning a little bit, and have not lost enough density that you can count hairs over a bald spot, I suggest dropping the Rogaine, sticking with the Propecia, adding the Nizoral, and .... be patient. Wait until April before you get concerned. Your hair isn't going to go anywhere in 4 months even if it seems that it is shedding. Shedding is just growth and resting phases, and those hairs that you shed aren't "Dead" just because they fell out. Those same hairs will grow back in in 4-8 months. Propecia decides whether they grow back in healthier or not.

gourmetstylewellness.com

 

[RalphyWiggum]

gourmetstylewellness.com,

You truly are a man of like-mind it's great to see an admin who isn't afraid to state his opinion on products!

Glad I never joined the fartel cartel

 

[MrTelogen]

That was definitely a kick-*** answer.

 

[getting_impatient!!!]

Thanks GourmetStyleWellness!

That has more than helped with my confusion and worries!

I can't count the hairs on a specific area. I still have guite a bit of hair on top. BUT, I and a few others have noticed it is easier to see through to my scalp than it was say....two or three years ago!

My brother has lost most of his on top but when he started to lose it he used Rogaine for a while and noticed regrowth. He quit when he started flaking though.

I sure wish I knew about Nizoral when I first started! Do you think I may have missed out on some results from not using it these first four months? Or am I still in a good time frame to not hinder the effects of the Propecia?

Another question...how long can I save Rogaine? I have almost a full bottle left. I am going to stop using it, but I do not want to waste it.

 

[MrTelogen]

Send me the Rogaine! LOL Get some nizoral and you should do just fine.You have time.

 

[bufftat]

Propecia patent

Can someone please tell me when the Propecia patent runs out?

 

[thinman]

hopefully soon, so Merck can get off their *** and try to really solve the problem.

 

[Nelson]

Patent on Propecia

Merck's patent on Propecia expires in December '04. 2 more years!
:x

 

[MrTelogen]

Merck's patent on Propecia expires in December '04. 2 more years!

What happens afterwards, generics?

 

[Nelson]

Propecia Patent

You're damn right, generics! Finasteride will be available for far less. Probably less than half what were paying now.
$50 a month is a rip-off.
But anyone discourgaged over Propecia for financial reasons should hang in there until 2005.

:wink:

 

[X190]

Suggestions Please!!!

I have been trying to hold off on Finasteride with every possible method known on earth including Saw Palmetto, Anti-Oxidants, Minoxidil solutions, and I continue to receed at temples and forehead.

I am holding a bottle of 30 tablets of Propecia 1mg right now in my hand and every known horrible thing that has been said about this drug is all of a sudden blowing by my mind...

Does anybody have any suggestions before I begin my first dose? (e.g. start with .5mg, take at a certain time, etc...) Any pointers may help. I am currently 22 years old, (soon to turn 23) and have a thick Norwood 2 except for thin hairline and temples.

Thanx!

X

 

[Guest]

Take the plunge. 1 MG from the get. It is factual that the side effect responders are in the minority (albiet a vocal one) and that most escape the side effects. If you do get some, they may pass.

I have been on a year and has some SE in the early going. Straightened out and I am getting nice regrowth on the crown. I also use minoxidil and nizoral.

Good luck

Brucelee

 

[thinman]

bruce

i am on the fence of propecia, giving revivogen a chance. my only question to u is the 2% that experienced sexual side effects, were they documented at all...just cause if i was on a trial, and if i didnt rise to the occasion i wouldnt be too quick to report it. how long did the side effects last if u dont mind me asking? and i am afraid of a Telogen Effluvium, are there any indications why some1 would have a Telogen Effluvium.
as always thxs