Social Drawbacks To Being An Incel ( Not Only Relationship )

[CopeForLife]

rudi why are you still here instead of slaying that jap pussies

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

Another example of internalized incelism,

I'm taking a dance class right now (west coast swing). I am awkward and poorly coordinated but it's in good fun, as it's an introductory class and thus everybody is making mistakes.

In one sequence on Wednesday that we were practicing, the leader (the man) reaches his arm to the follower's (the woman's) upper back/shoulder halfway through, just after she pivots. In one of the practice runs, I got it wrong and grabbed her left boob. Honest mistake.

I, of course, was worried that she would be offended. That could turn out really badly, she might make a scene, humiliate me, everyone will side with her, I'll walk out in shame and never return.

That's not what happened. She laughed in a friendly manner, she apologized for being very ticklish, and we went back to dancing.

 

[Exodus2011]

The reason I know is because I'm also attractive.

*TRIGGER WARNING HUMBLE BRAG MIXED WITH "It's not fair I'm so pretty" BULLSHIT*

I am a pretty calm person outside of this forum, I realise how to be respectful towards others and take a moment if I feel like losing my cool, because I'm basically not a c***, people really do think I'm an incredibly nice guy. When I'm not, at least in terms of what society would generally classify as a "nice guy", I really am cynical about most people, I can get quite judgemental, and I feel this is all justified. I think 80% or more of people are quite deplorable, hypocritical, narcissistic beyond a salvegeable point, I don't know if I'm any different, but I know for certain that I'm being treated different.

And I need to remove the element of women altogether when talking about this, because obviously there's a bias in the way that I want any advantage over women that I can get. I don't give a sh*t about being treated positively for something outside my control, I'll just embrace it, no questions ask.

But it's the friendship bonds I instantly form with men who seem to be somewhat admirable of the fact I'm a good looking guy who is somewhat impressionable and has humour and opinions, these could all be at a basic level, or I could be hilarious and incredibly interesting. The point is, I'll never know, I don't know how to gauge what I am and what I'm progressing towards as a person.

We've posted TedTalks on here about supermodels who feel shitty because they don't know their true value as people, and my instinctive reaction is "f*****g bullshit!" but no, it's not at all. I can imagine it being ten times worse for attractive females as their value as a person, within themselves, is diminished to nothing. On top of that there's a guilt of "I didn't actually do anything to deserve adoration".

I can imagine many people's reaction to this as "wah wah wah I've been gifted so many opportunities of happiness without any payback whatsoever" well f*** off. If you're average or ugly at least you understand how you are as a human being and can gauge what you're about, because I'm completely f*****g clueless, and this does not inspire productivity.

Anything I do or be will be lauded and praised even if it's mediocre, so what's the f*****g point.

you were good up until this point lol. its undeniably an issue, but obviously nowhere near as much an issue (exponentially less so ) than being inferior. how i am as a human being? man i got the same problem, i have a failo effect so anything i do isn't really taken for its own sake, same as you, except in a negative direction.

perhaps ideal is being 5-6 in looks. idk. okay enough to not be considered ugly, but not so hot to where you are seen as a romantic/sexual object only

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

I think when someone writes what they are, there's a gut instinct to believe they are compensating for what they are not. That gut instinct is often wrong, especially when examining someone closely and their perception of themselves.

While there's times when I get angry, I have way too many instances of people constantly telling me I'm a nice guy, especially when they don't need to or feel this is an "admission" that they don't want to admit, that I know for sure that this is what I'm perceived as.

You didn't explain very well as to why you thought this, it was one sentence, and I'm going to mark this down to another "David-ism" of bitterness and intended malice out of nothing, rather than forming a reasonable opinion based on anything, it's just bias against me. The other day you Liked posts against me that blackg made about me being generally and vaguely unlikable, but his posts were ridiculously broad and nonsensical.

You don't normally engage with such vague posts but you Liked these ones. It's pretty clear to me that it was about me, and you couldn't care less about the reasoning behind them, as long as it's about me, as someone who badmouthed you, that's all that matters.

Keep pretending that there was nothing more to my attack on you than "jumping on the bandwagon" but acknowledge that I waited until everyone else had finished, because I don't want to be lumped in with them. Like you acknowledged, I am not afraid of thinking for and expressing myself in my own ways, and your attempt at saying I am "ganging up" on you, rather than focusing on what I actually said, is a clear sign of insecurity, and that would be insecurity of the truth.

I actually did write out a long explanation, but then I deleted it prior to posting because I wasn't sure if you'd be able to read it. I suspected that you might respond violently, particularly if I was right about you.

You confirmed my suspicion about you. If I had been wrong about you you would have responded with something like: "I'm honestly skeptical, but would you care to elaborate?"

 

[CopeForLife]

mirin of David's NTness

yoga, dances and a lot of social interactions

 

[Exodus2011]

i've literally been having extreme feelings and ruminations and thoughts of inferiority every 10 or so seconds for the past few days now, to where i literally almost trip and hit my head on things because i'm so distracted by the thoughts

@Rudiger you have absolutely no idea what this absolute f*****g hell is like lol. no offense but that "issue" is bunnies and rainbows compared to this

 

[Exodus2011]

I actually did write out a long explanation, but then I deleted it prior to posting because I wasn't sure if you'd be able to read it. I suspected that you might respond violently, particularly if I was right about you.

You confirmed my suspicion about you. If I had been wrong about you you would have responded with something like: "I'm honestly skeptical, but would you care to elaborate?"

imo rudiger is smart and nice but has a sore ego and can be mean if insulted. a lot of people here seem narcissistic a bit though to be totally honest. we're all mourning over our lost social worth after all, it would be expected.

something you said that was narcissistic seeming was saying most people are "low quality" , not that i disagree though L O L. I'd say there's a lot of people that are easily led astray by emotions, and don't have the reasoning skills to check/vet them for accuracy

 

[Rudiger]

you were good up until this point lol. its undeniably an issue, but obviously nowhere near as much an issue (exponentially less so ) than being inferior. how i am as a human being? b**ch i got the same problem, i have a failo effect so anything i do isn't really taken for its own sake, same as you, except in a negative direction.

perhaps ideal is being 5-6 in looks. idk. okay enough to not be considered ugly, but not so hot to where you are seen as a romantic/sexual object only

Well that's interesting, I guess you're right, being average looking for most people is the only way of realising your value as a contributing human being to society, or even just to yourself.

If you're too ugly, who gives a f*** what you do? If you're too good looking, everything you do is impressive.

But I'd argue at least if you're ugly, you can fight against your pre-conceived awful personality and win people over.

Here's an interesting thought- there's this midget I used to work with who had numerous, countless aesthetic issue. His face looked like it was burned, I think it was acne, his hands weren't formed properly, this was freakshow stuff (I'm so sensitive).

And he was incredibly confident (triggered) and made people laugh constantly, he was consistently seen as being great fun etc. Except, his jokes were sh*t. I am not a moron, I know what is humour, and I appreciate what is humour to others that may not be to my tastes. But this guy was genuinely unfunny, and lauded as the hilarious midget of the office.

I definitely admired his spirit, but hated his personality. And I was the only one, for everyone else he was hilarious. I wish I still had the facebook screencaps of just how sh*t his jokes were.

So I guess that worked in his favour. He wasn't a bad guy or anything, I don't dislike him, but he was encouraged by people that he was funny, when he wasn't, if I had made these same jokes there would be dead silence.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

imo rudiger is smart and nice but has a sore ego and can be mean if insulted. a lot of people here seem narcissistic a bit though to be totally honest. we're all mourning over our lost social worth after all, it would be expected.

I think that's a good assessment actually.

 

[CopeForLife]

i've literally been having extreme feelings and ruminations and thoughts of inferiority every 10 or so seconds for the past few days now, to where i literally almost trip and hit my head on things because i'm so distracted by the thoughts

@Rudiger you have absolutely no idea what this absolute f*****g hell is like lol. no offense but that "issue" is bunnies and rainbows compared to this

I just had a city nightly walk for a few hours and discussed hapa inferiority with an imagined listener in my head...

I narrated key points of ER manifesto how his sister was hot while he was weird looking incel and etc

Just in case if there will be an occasion to drop a black pill IRL

I should be prepared

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

something you said that was narcissistic seeming was saying most people are "low quality" , not that i disagree though L O L. I'd say there's a lot of people that are easily led astray by emotions, and don't have the reasoning skills to check/vet them for accuracy

In hindsight I think that's a valid point. I made a statement which I shouldn't make based on the standards I often suggest to others. I don't actually know if the low-quality statement is true, as far as I know it's not something that's been measured.

 

[Exodus2011]

Well that's interesting, I guess you're right, being average looking for most people is the only way of realising your value as a contributing human being to society, or even just to yourself.

If you're too ugly, who gives a f*** what you do? If you're too good looking, everything you do is impressive.

But I'd argue at least if you're ugly, you can fight against your pre-conceived awful personality and win people over.

Here's an interesting thought- there's this midget I used to work with who had numerous, countless aesthetic issue. His face looked like it was burned, I think it was acne, his hands weren't formed properly, this was freakshow stuff (I'm so sensitive).

And he was incredibly confident (triggered) and made people laugh constantly, he was consistently seen as being great fun etc. Except, his jokes were sh*t. I am not a moron, I know what is humour, and I appreciate what is humour to others that may not be to my tastes. But this guy was genuinely unfunny, and lauded as the hilarious midget of the office.

I definitely admired his spirit, but hated his personality. And I was the only one, for everyone else he was hilarious. I wish I still had the facebook screencaps of just how sh*t his jokes were.

So I guess that worked in his favour. He wasn't a bad guy or anything, I don't dislike him, but he was encouraged by people that he was funny, when he wasn't, if I had made these same jokes there would be dead silence.

sounds like he was so ugly that he got the pity points. like penguin from batman lmao. if i were you i'd try breaking to him in a nice way that he isn't funny, i'm sure everyone thinks of doing it but doesnt wanna hurt his feelings. f*** thats depressing though, like damn can't even do anything about it

i know people who are very ugly too, i know 2 guys off hand that are 5'2 and under, AND aren't aesthetic in the face either. they aren't depressed, however they are average intelligence at best so could just be low awareness.

 

[Exodus2011]

In hindsight I think that's a valid point. I made a statement which I shouldn't make based on the standards I often suggest to others. I don't actually know if the low-quality statement is true, as far as I know it's not something that's been measured.

i can really relate, i'm sure you KNOW deep down no one is "worth" more than others, but we can't help but make that judgment as beings with instincts for social relations, i think its like from our primate past.

one thing that i can't help but feel is the closest to "worth" though is intelligence. like its the most important trait of being human imo. actually being aware of reality, and knowing how to control it, its cheating survival. don't have to worry about who is the fastest or strongest or luckiest, now we can literally control the environment to make survival easy peasy, which ironically enough now makes the more primitive traits important again. since intelligence guaranteed everyone safety in civilization, now the hot and strong and popular guys are getting laid and selected for.

iirc its an actual hypothesis in evo psych, we evolved intelligence, and intelligence made itself unimportant by guaranteeing everyone survival with tech. nowadays with our ever more complex world being smart is more important than ever though. it just seems like being socially adjusted and hot is better for survival and success than being smart.

2001 was about this, part of why its one of my favorite films ever, was gonna chime in when you discussed it with blackg but i never did haha. i think the monolith granted us consciousness/intelligence, and of course the latter is the next step, which obviously is intrinsically unimaginable

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

sounds like he was so ugly that he got the pity points. like penguin from batman lmao. if i were you i'd try breaking to him in a nice way that he isn't funny, i'm sure everyone thinks of doing it but doesnt wanna hurt his feelings. f*** thats depressing though, like damn can't even do anything about it

i know people who are very ugly too, i know 2 guys off hand that are 5'2 and under, AND aren't aesthetic in the face either. they aren't depressed, however they are average intelligence at best so could just be low awareness.

The most likely explanation for other people laughing at the guy's jokes is that they find the jokes funny.

I can see someone getting pity points, but not on a sustained and consistent basis. The thing about artificial pity is that it's unlikely to sustain.

 

[CaptainForehead]

mourning over our lost social worth

That's so eloquent man. Makes you feel.

 

[Exodus2011]

The most likely explanation for other people laughing at the guy's jokes is that they find the jokes funny.

I can see someone getting pity points, but not on a sustained and consistent basis. The thing about artificial pity is that it's unlikely to sustain.

maybe idk. i hope so . just guessing based on my own reaction to truly aesthetically challenged people, not just 4s like myself.

one time i was talking to a legit sub 5 foot guy, i felt so bad and awkward i couldn't look at him directly . f*** i probably made him feel bad

 

[Exodus2011]

That's so eloquent man. Makes you feel.

its such a taboo subject, no one wants to admit how much looks matter, like idk i can see WHY society blue pills you, they have to encounter a deeply uncomfortable truth to really honestly give advice about it. the truth that the way your f*****g bones come together can make you a demi god.

idk goddamn i'm always mentally masturbating about this stuff, trying to come to terms with the idea of people being superior and inferior, relationships, people always tick me off, constant arguments, its like baldness has made me hate 90% of people . i have no patience for anyone anymore. it sucks so much. i remember when i had hair, and when i was starting to finally feel confident, how understanding and optimistic i was about others. i miss that feeling so bad it hurts.

its funny at this point i'm more focused on the offshoot issues baldness makes you have

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

Internalized incelism. Can relate.
I would have the same reaction, especially at the yoga incident.

Something related. In my first visit to the brothel, it was lingerie night. Occasionally a girl would take off her top/bottom in the lounge area (where everyone was hanging out). I felt unable to look. I only looked furtively at the bodies of the lingerie women. Otherwise, it was only looking at the face.
If a woman touched me on the torso below my chest, my abs had a tendency to spasm out.

Good job on taking the dance class. How did you find out about the class?

Yeah I'm very proud of putting those two words together lol. Maybe too proud? If I were joining the forum now I might very well make "Internalized Incelism" into my user name.

I relate to you spasming out. When I went to the brothel, I guess I didn't stare at body parts either, it felt artificial (indeed it is artificial) when women walk up to me in a brothel bar and ask me questions. Then, when we shared a room, I did grab her and give her superficial affection, but my mind did not do so and I did not feel affection or excitement. She did try hard. I think I might need a f*****g Xanax more than a v****.

What I'd suggest is that wanting women and liking women is part of your nature, and that since the brothel route is actually working on you, that you consider doing so a few more times. The real you is the you that wants to f*** women, and meanwhile, the you that avoids women out of fear of scaring them is a toxic surface layer that you should consider peeling off.

The dance class I discovered by accident. I've been hanging out in that neighborhood a lot because my therapist works there and because the animal shelter is near there and because they have incredibly delicious food. I noticed it walking by and decided to try it out.

A few of my friends from college do swing dancing. Separately, a friend of a friend (who has his own problems) took dancing classes when he was younger to improve his body language, so that he'd stop walking like a gangly nerd. I don't know if that makes any sense, but that's what he did.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

maybe idk. i hope so . just guessing based on my own reaction to truly aesthetically challenged people, not just 4s like myself.

one time i was talking to a legit sub 5 foot guy, i felt so bad and awkward i couldn't look at him directly . f*** i probably made him feel bad

You feel pity for aesthetically-challenged people, other people like Rudiger feel revulsion (read his post ), and a lot of other people just don't care that much. They're not willing to date ugly people or have them in leadership positions, but they don't mind having them around.

For whatever it's worth I also feel pity for hopelessly ugly people. I work on a university campus, so I feel pity for the very short guys, and the guys who are NW2 or NW3 early in college. But that's because I (like you) overanalyze these issues, and thus I know what's in store for them.

 

[Rudiger]

I actually did write out a long explanation, but then I deleted it prior to posting because I wasn't sure if you'd be able to read it. I suspected that you might respond violently, particularly if I was right about you.

You confirmed my suspicion about you. If I had been wrong about you you would have responded with something like: "I'm honestly skeptical, but would you care to elaborate?"

Firstly you didn't indulge in all of the sh*t I just wrote about you, I don't know what that means.

You wouldn't be sure if I was able to read it? I don't understand this. Write what you want.

I also don't understand what your suspicion about me actually is, and I highly doubt you do either. I think the reason you deleted your lengthy response is because you had no clue what you were dissecting, and basing arguments on emotion rather than logic. This is why I have no concern in probing deeper in to your thoughts, because I've seen it time and time again on this forum, where you are clearly biased towards your own selfish mentality.

@Rudiger you have absolutely no idea what this absolute f*****g hell is like lol. no offense but that "issue" is bunnies and rainbows compared to this

Oh do not get me wrong! At all, I am not comparing apples with oranges. Undoubtedly being ugly and unappreciated is a far more lonely world than being attractive and over-appreciated. Basically I'm saying life is sh*t for everyone, if you have some self-awareness at least, the only way to truly survive in this world with eternal happiness, is to be pre-disposed with some form of humble mentality (which cannot be taught) or to be incredibly stupid.

If you are intelligent and self-aware, and don't have this ingrained humble mentality, you are always going to second guess yourself. Well the ugly or even average don't have to do this.

Exo I really like the way you can still take a step back and calmly explain this to me as I'm practically someone from a different universe to the world you've experienced, rather than just telling me I'm an entitled piece of sh*t.