Who Would Help Fund A Kerastem Therapy?

[Blackber]

Forgot to ask -- how big were the scabs on your scalp and how long till they go away? I will definitely grow my hair a little to conceal them, but I wonder how large they are in general

They use a blunt tip cannula to inject the fat, you can google them to see what they look like. I was told the scabs are minimal and they do not leave behind any scarring.

I can't speak for how fast the scabs go away yet but I don't see them lasting any longer than a normal scab on your body/face.

Do you think you will have a visible scar from the lipo? That is a big turnoff for me. Beside possibly wasting a sh*tload of money

The scare will be tiny and depending on where you ask they to make the incision I don't think it'll be too noticeable

Just an update for everyone on my situation. I'm all booked and ready to go. I've been in contact with the clinic and they've given me all my information. They've really been great with communication and details which has made me feel much more comfortable being that I'm coming from the US. I leave NY on Sunday, looking forward to it and enjoying the freedom that Lynney is by not having to do daily treatments anymore.

 

[Dlogic]

Do you guys know long this treatment will last?

 

[Blackber]

Do you guys know long this treatment will last?

I don't think anyone knows. It's only been around for a year or two.

 

[Blackber]

And so my journey begins...

Just got through security, waiting to board the plane to Belgrade.

I'll let you guys know how things go.

 

[hilbert]

And so my journey begins...

Just got through security, waiting to board the plane to Belgrade.

I'll let you guys know how things go.

wish you the best luck. we'll stay tuned.

 

[wilfred]

Good luck Blackber! I'm still saving up for mine.

I can't help but laugh at the concerns with the lipo scars. I had lipo for gynocomastia and I previously posted the the 2 scars were undetectable, which I thought they were... I then went and looked for them. Yes they are detectable, but only if you look for them. They are SO SMALL.. like a freckle. I didn't know I had them until I looked for them.

 

[wilfred]

Did the lipo resolve your gynecomastia issue?

Yes, excision and lipo.

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Update from other forum:

posted by Christopher1, 14.05.2016, 18:13
Gentlemen,

After having brought you some bad news about my Jak inhibitor trial, I finally have some good news for you. It's not great, but it's very good.

My hair has stopped falling out. It stopped about three weeks ago, which was a bit over 2 months after my Kerastem treatment. How do I know it stopped falling out? Every day since my hair loss began over 15 years ago, I have taken water from the faucet and run it through my hair to style it. And every day for 15 years, with rare exceptions, my hands look like Chewbacca paws when I am finished doing this. Now nothing comes out when I wet my hair and run my hands through it. I find no hairs on my pillow case in the morning. For now it appears as if my hair loss has stopped.

I have not seen any regrowth. Who knows if it will come? Who knows if this will last either. For now, even if I didn't get regrowth, I would be very pleased if I was able to go few more years without hair loss, until better treatments come out.

I will let you know if my condition changes for the better or worse when more time has elapsed.

Good luck.

 

[Blackber]

Yes, excision and lipo.

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Update from other forum:

posted by Christopher1, 14.05.2016, 18:13
Gentlemen,

After having brought you some bad news about my Jak inhibitor trial, I finally have some good news for you. It's not great, but it's very good.

My hair has stopped falling out. It stopped about three weeks ago, which was a bit over 2 months after my Kerastem treatment. How do I know it stopped falling out? Every day since my hair loss began over 15 years ago, I have taken water from the faucet and run it through my hair to style it. And every day for 15 years, with rare exceptions, my hands look like Chewbacca paws when I am finished doing this. Now nothing comes out when I wet my hair and run my hands through it. I find no hairs on my pillow case in the morning. For now it appears as if my hair loss has stopped.

I have not seen any regrowth. Who knows if it will come? Who knows if this will last either. For now, even if I didn't get regrowth, I would be very pleased if I was able to go few more years without hair loss, until better treatments come out.

I will let you know if my condition changes for the better or worse when more time has elapsed.

Good luck.

Thanks for the update Wilfred.

I'm in Belgrade right now. Been terribly jet lagged so I've been in and out of sleep since I've been here but I'm undergoing the treatment tomorrow.

I'll keep you guys updated as things progress.

 

[Aleksandar]

Thanks for the update Wilfred.

I'm in Belgrade right now. Been terribly jet lagged so I've been in and out of sleep since I've been here but I'm undergoing the treatment tomorrow.

I'll keep you guys updated as things progress.

Good luck! Hope the procedure is successful and you grow a lot of new thick shiny hairs!

 

[Blackber]

Thanks man!

I'm at the clinic now. Very nice facility and staff.

 

[Knockin on nw4]

here are some ADSC results


Recently, satisfactory results for hair regeneration have been achieved in 12 women with FPHL and 13 men, 12 with androgenic alopecia and 1 with androgenic alopecia and alopecia areata, as determined by a visual analog scale. All patients were treated with an ADSC-CM which includes various cytokines and growth factors: a commercial advanced adipose-derived stem cell protein extract (AAPEâ„¢) was used. This extract contains numerous growth factors and regeneration-promoting proteins. Its main components include PDGF (44.41 ± 2.56 pg/ml), bFGF (131.35) ± 30.31 pg/ml), KGF (86.28 ± 20.33 pg/ml), TGF-β1 (103.33 ± 1.70 pg/ml), HGF (670.94 ± 86.92 pg/ml), VEGF (809.53 ± 95.98 pg/ml), collagen (921.47 ± 49.65 pg/ml), fibronectin (1466.48 ± 460.21 pg/ml), and SOD in 5 ml saline solution, to which, in the present study, buflomedyl, cysteine, coenzyme Q10, and vitamins were added. This solution was applied 4 to 6 times every 3 to 5 weeks by mesotherapy techniques, such as nappage and papule injections with 30g or 32G needle.
Patients received follow-up examinations at 2- to 4-month intervals for at least 1 year after the final treatment session. Patients experienced increased hair growth with good results and without adverse effects including bacterial infections and granuloma. Hair regrowth was maintained for at least 1.5 years, but this was dependent on patient age. Men older than 60 years had the least maintenance of hair regrowth, followed by men 50–60 years old and women older than 60 years. Men younger than 50 years and women younger than 60 years maintained hair regrowth between 1.5 and 2.5 years. (Fukuoka et al., 2012).
In another study by the same group, ADSC-CM (enriched AAPE™, as prepared in the previous study) was intra-dermally injected in 22 patients (11 men and 11 women) with alopecia. Intradermal injections with a 31G needle provided about 0.02 ml/cm2 of solution. Patients received treatment every 3 to 5 weeks for a total of 6 sessions. Some male patients received finasteride, as well. Hair numbers were counted using trichograms before and 1 to 3 months after treatment. A half-side comparison study was also performed in 10 patients (8 men and 2 women). Hair numbers were significantly increased after treatment in both male (including those without finasteride administration, without significant differences in the two groups) and female patients. The mean increase was 29 ± 4.1 in male and 15.6 ± 4.2 in female patients. In the half-side comparison study, the increase in hair numbers was significantly higher on the treatment side than on the placebo side (Fukuoka et al., 2015).
Shin and coworkers performed a retrospective, observational study of outcomes in 27 patients (men patient age 41.9 ± 13.4 years) with female pattern hair loss (FPHL) treated with ADSC-CM. The commercial product AAPE™, produced from human subcutaneous adipose tissue obtained by medical liposuction from healthy persons from which ADSC were isolated and in vitro expanded till passage 4 under hypoxic conditions, was used.
Finally, conditioned media were collected and microfiltered: for fresh use, 4-ml vials containing equal protein concentrations were freeze-dried as a single lot sample preparation of AAPEâ„¢. The treatment course consisted of repeated applications of ADSC-CM once per week for 12 consecutive weeks. To evaluate the efficacy of the treatment, patients’medical records and phototrichographic images were analysed. The application of ADSC-CM showed efficacy in treating FPHL after 12 weeks of therapy. Mean hair density increased from 105.4 to 122.7 hairs/cm2 (P < 0.001), representing an increase of 16.4%. Mean hair thickness increased from 57.5 μm to 64.0 μm (P < 0.001), an increase of 11.3%. None of the patients reported severe adverse reactions or irritation or itching, suggesting application of ADSC-CM is a potential treatment option also for FPHL (Shin et al., 2015).

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That data is from bioscience clinic. Not the greatest data, small sample sizes, mediocre results with several treatments. But at least the results you do get seem to last a couple years for younger people

 

[TheShining]

Thanks man!

I'm at the clinic now. Very nice facility and staff.

I hope everything went well and that you feel good!

 

[Blackber]

So I had the procedure done Tuesday, I've been doing a lot of sleeping, resting and a little bit of site seeing.

I got to hang with Vincent777 for a bit and am meeting him in a little while to grab a burger.

Today is my last day in Belgrade my flight back to New York is very early Friday morning.

As far as the procedure everything went very smooth. I can't say enough about how clean the clinic was and how friendly the staff is. There is barely any pain or swelling in my scalp. My stomach is pretty sore from the lipo but nothing too bad - they gave me pain killers but there's no reason to take them.

I didn't have a lot of fat so Dr. Katerina recommended we make three entry points. One through my belly button, and then the other two on each side of my waist line. The entry points obviously haven't healed yet but if there was anyone worries about the scars you really shouldn't worry. They are so small I highly doubt anyone will ever notice them.

I'm not a big traveler and I've never had any medical procedures done in the past but I felt very comfortable with the clinic. They provided me with everything and really took care of me.

Now we'll just have to wait and see if there's any regrowth, but I'm pretty confident I'll be a good responder due to my specific type of hair loss. I have a follow up with Dr. Katerina tonight before I leave for my flight.

If anyone has any questions for me let me know.

Thanks for all the good wishes.

 

[Stupidon]

If anyone has any questions for me let me know.

Thanks for all the good wishes.

Hi Blackber,


Did some people do the procedure while they were on minoxidil and/or Finasteride? Do they have data on this matter and if so, after the procedure, it is possible to cease the medication without losing these minoxidil/Fina hairs?


Also, one part is really unclear to me. I know they are offering this treatment since only a couple of years, but maybe more in Japan. What are their expectations in term of maintenance which seems to be the only interesting side of Kerastmen? 5-10 years is quite vague...

 

[JustAnotherNoob]

So I had the procedure done Tuesday, I've been doing a lot of sleeping, resting and a little bit of site seeing.

I got to hang with Vincent777 for a bit and am meeting him in a little while to grab a burger.

Today is my last day in Belgrade my flight back to New York is very early Friday morning.

As far as the procedure everything went very smooth. I can't say enough about how clean the clinic was and how friendly the staff is. There is barely any pain or swelling in my scalp. My stomach is pretty sore from the lipo but nothing too bad - they gave me pain killers but there's no reason to take them.

I didn't have a lot of fat so Dr. Katerina recommended we make three entry points. One through my belly button, and then the other two on each side of my waist line. The entry points obviously haven't healed yet but if there was anyone worries about the scars you really shouldn't worry. They are so small I highly doubt anyone will ever notice them.

I'm not a big traveler and I've never had any medical procedures done in the past but I felt very comfortable with the clinic. They provided me with everything and really took care of me.

Now we'll just have to wait and see if there's any regrowth, but I'm pretty confident I'll be a good responder due to my specific type of hair loss. I have a follow up with Dr. Katerina tonight before I leave for my flight.

If anyone has any questions for me let me know.

Thanks for all the good wishes.

Congrats!! Wishing you luck for regrowth!

How big are the scabs on your head? Are you also wearing the lipo waist trainer thing? Did you get any more insight on the procedure other than the pics and stuff we were shown in the skype session?

 

[Dragonborn]

For some reason this forum is bugged for me so I can't reply with quote to Blackbears comment.
Anyways best of wishes to you Blackbear. If you or lyney show a modicum of regrowth I might consider this as well.
Did they show pictures of some successful regrowth in Belgrade prior to procedure or when you were doing the Skype call? Did anyone in those pictures show some major regrowth?
I mean on Kerastems main page the one guy there shows some moderate improvement however if that is the best outcome it is not confidence inducing.

 

[Blackber]

Hey guys I'm on my phone so I'm going to do my best to reply accurately.

Hi Blackber,


Did some people do the procedure while they were on minoxidil and/or Finasteride? Do they have data on this matter and if so, after the procedure, it is possible to cease the medication without losing these minoxidil/Fina hairs?


Also, one part is really unclear to me. I know they are offering this treatment since only a couple of years, but maybe more in Japan. What are their expectations in term of maintenance which seems to be the only interesting side of Kerastmen? 5-10 years is quite vague...

They didn't have any data showing differences between Kerastem only results and Kerastem + minoxidil/finasteride results. Dr. Katerina's belief is that there will never be a single solution for hair loss and that it'll be a combination of treatments that eventually defeats it. She said there's so many different reasons (hormones, genetics, general health, diet, etc.) for hair loss that she thinks multiple treatments will be needed.

Kerastem is being trialed and advertised on their own website indicating no other treatments are required and while you can still achieve results with Kerastem only Dr.Katerina believes you'll get better results if you continue to take minoxidil and finasteride if it works for you. Personally I never took finasteride for a long time because of sides, I took minoxidil for almost a year but its effects wore off (which is the reason I went for Kerastem) therefore I do not plan on taking anymore daily treatments.

Kerastem will never regrow a full head of hair and the best responders achieve 30% regrowth so you have to manage your expectations.

Dr. Katerina said she had one older patient who had great regrowth and has maintained those results for two years - he was treated in 2014. Not sure where you're getting the 5-10 year timeframe from. I've personally never heard that and it's impossible for anyone to know how long it will last.

Congrats!! Wishing you luck for regrowth!

How big are the scabs on your head? Are you also wearing the lipo waist trainer thing? Did you get any more insight on the procedure other than the pics and stuff we were shown in the skype session?

I honestly didn't even get scabs on my head. My whole scalp was a little tender and it was a little swollen in 4-6 spots where they made the injections. It's been two days since the treatment. The swollen spots are gone and my scalp is almost completely back to normal. I would not worry about anyone seeing the injection points.

Yes I'm wearing the lipo waist trainer.

I was not shown any additional pictures but I didn't ask.

I know you're planning on doing this on a trip you're taking later on. I definitely recommend you do this at the end of your trip on your way back home. The pain from the lipo is nothing too bad but you're better off healing at home then walking around doing tourist stuff on a trip.

For some reason this forum is bugged for me so I can't reply with quote to Blackbears comment.
Anyways best of wishes to you Blackbear. If you or lyney show a modicum of regrowth I might consider this as well.
Did they show pictures of some successful regrowth in Belgrade prior to procedure or when you were doing the Skype call? Did anyone in those pictures show some major regrowth?
I mean on Kerastems main page the one guy there shows some moderate improvement however if that is the best outcome it is not confidence inducing.

Yes! The forum has been very buggy for me as well the past week.

During the skype session they show you all the pictures from Kerastems website and 2 additional ones. One of the patients not shown on the Kerastem website had significant regrowth - way more than the guy on the Kerastem website.

Kerastem is not for everyone as I've said before. It's definitely not cheap and it is a bit of a leap of faith but it was worth a chance to me. Time will tell over the next few months if it works for me but I feel better that I just didn't sit still using minoxidil and not try something else.

 

[Pray The Bald Away]

She said there's so many different reasons (hormones, genetics, general health, diet, etc.) for hair loss that she thinks multiple treatments will be needed.

Genetics determine sensitivity to hormones. Fix the hormone sensitivity and you've officially cured male pattern baldness.

 

[Blackber]

Genetics determine sensitivity to hormones. Fix the hormone sensitivity and you've officially cured male pattern baldness.

The only thing that's remotely close to doing that would be Replicel I would imagine.

All those gene therapy treatments are yearssss away in my opinion. We don't even have proper regulations in place for stem cell treatments never mind gene therapy.

 

[Stupidon]

Hey guys I'm on my phone so I'm going to do my best to reply accurately.
Kerastem will never regrow a full head of hair and the best responders achieve 30% regrowth so you have to manage your expectations.

Dr. Katerina said she had one older patient who had great regrowth and has maintained those results for two years - he was treated in 2014. Not sure where you're getting the 5-10 year timeframe from. I've personally never heard that and it's impossible for anyone to know how long it will last.

Thanks for the answer.

I am just interested in maintenance as I have just a very slightly receding hairline at the moment. But 4500€ for 2 years, this is ridiculous. A guy in a french forum did the procedure in Geneva and if he confirmed they could not answer on how long the results would last, they said it might save you a decade.

I will try my luck too after this summer and hopefully buy a fair amount of time.