why hairloss forums can be bias towards pesimism

[person22]

hi all,
i just thought id give my opinion on this;
when i was in my teens i had very bad acne, i got obsessed with it and would try every new theory or supplement i could find on acne forums, ofcourse none of them worked, the only proven medication that stops acne is called roaccutane (i guess its the acne equivilant of propecia! ) , but although everyone new it worked no one knew if i worked long term, and this is for the reason that it does ! so no one comes back ! once youve solved a problem you move on with your life, it worked for me so i have absolutely no reason to go back to an acne forum,
this i believe is the same on hair loss forums, we all come here with the products were using DONT work but if they actually did work we wouldnt come here,
so what your left with on hair loss forums are newbies and people who arent reacting positively to the treatments, so this leads us to think nothing will work,
how many people are out there who minoxidil worked amazing for 10 yrs ago and r still using it without giving it a second thought? only the people who it stopped working for would come back, i know this post isnt that helpfull but maybe itll give some people some positivity ??
and as i final thought im now gonna go back to that acne forum a decade later and tell those kids that it does work long term with no long term side effects and hopefully someone who used this forum a decade ago will do the same!

 

[WarLord]

hi all,
i just thought id give my opinion on this;
when i was in my teens i had very bad acne, i got obsessed with it and would try every new theory or supplement i could find on acne forums, ofcourse none of them worked, the only proven medication that stops acne is called roaccutane (i guess its the acne equivilant of propecia! ) , but although everyone new it worked no one knew if i worked long term, and this is for the reason that it does ! so no one comes back ! once youve solved a problem you move on with your life, it worked for me so i have absolutely no reason to go back to an acne forum,
this i believe is the same on hair loss forums, we all come here with the products were using DONT work but if they actually did work we wouldnt come here,
so what your left with on hair loss forums are newbies and people who arent reacting positively to the treatments, so this leads us to think nothing will work,
how many people are out there who minoxidil worked amazing for 10 yrs ago and r still using it without giving it a second thought? only the people who it stopped working for would come back, i know this post isnt that helpfull but maybe itll give some people some positivity ??
and as i final thought im now gonna go back to that acne forum a decade later and tell those kids that it does work long term with no long term side effects and hopefully someone who used this forum a decade ago will do the same!

Exactly! I actually used both minoxidil and Roaccutane (isotretinoin) - with excellent long-term results, so I understand, what you mean. I have been on anti-hairloss treatments since December 1996 - at first on Alpicort F for some time (a little known, but very good anti-androgen topical of German provenience), then on 2% minoxidil until summer 2008, then on 5% minoxidil until today. As long as I used them, I HAVEN'T LOST A SINGLE HAIR! Well, I didn't regrow any hairs worthy of note, but the effect was so reliable that I decided to get my 1 cm of lost hairline in temples back. This was the only reason, why I started to visit internet forums one year ago. But instead of good pieces of advice, more often I started to encounter various wacky crackpots telling me that "minoxidil doesn't maintain hair no matter how often you use it" and "it loses efficiacy after 16 weeks". LOL

When you carefully analyze the posts on such forums, you will realize that the people report experiences that often happen in mere 1% users. This is the category of people that post here. As a result, the overall impression from the people's experiences is very depressive, because it seems that 50% users report side effects, and the remaining 50% complain that nothing works. Furthermore, there are maniacs, who are biased towards certain treatments (mainly minoxidil) and vilify them on every forum they come (e.g. Bryan the Bald Conehead or Decade Two-point IQ on Hairlosshelp.com). Frankly, visiting such forums and reading the negative posts almost turned me into a paranoic. The idea that I would have read these crappy posts 15 years ago is scary, because I would have been distressed from the possibility of renewed hairloss during the whole time.

Now I can take it with a grain of salt, and I understand that even the so-called scientific studies on hair loss can't be taken 100% seriously, because they produce results that are at variance with common sense and real-life results.

 

[lobsterlobster]

I'm with you guys. The negativity on here is infectious. It's hard to keep away from it. I think we can all agree on one thing: hair loss is a pain in the ***. BUT let's not let it detract too much from our lives. I've realized that I've spent the last year worrying about this constantly, and I'm tired of it. I want to enjoy life for the beautiful thing it is. After all--and this is huge--we may be the first generations of humans to not have to live an entirely bald life. Our scientific developments are truly exponential. Good news is coming, guys. Let's just hold it out till then.

 

[Quadzilla99]

This is totally true. I experienced little no loss for 10+years with propecia and nizoral. Then I stupidly took some steroids (thought I had conquered male pattern baldness lol) and lost a bunch of hair. Only reason I post here now tbh

 

[person22]

haha u just proved my point exactly, u would of never come back here unless u had to, so your opinion that these medications do actually work would have never been known !!!
its quite reassuring,
ive only been on minoxidil and nizoral for 2 months but ive had no shed and no further hairloss and even some regrowth, im now looking towards the long term !
i totally agree with u lobsterlobster but unfortunately its definitely one of those 'easier said than done' situations !

 

[WarLord]

This is totally true. I experienced little no loss for 10+years with propecia and nizoral. Then I stupidly took some steroids (thought I had conquered male pattern baldness lol) and lost a bunch of hair. Only reason I post here now tbh

What steroids did you take? I took Winstrol twice and I realized that it was an androgenic sh*t. Fortunately, minoxidil works so well in me that I had no problems with hair, although my face was covered with big red cysts. I have taken Anavar several times since that time, and it was O.K. Curiously, I even observed that it temporarily improved my chronical problems with seborrhea - it is so ludicrously a weak androgen! A gentle steroid!

In any case, Propecia (finasteride) won't do much against steroids - even against testosterone, because DHT levels increase dramatically. Minoxidil is the better option.

Ironically, the only time I experienced some loss of hair during the last 15 years was just this spring, after I stopped my experiments with 10-15% minoxidil. It really destroyed my hairline and I must hope that the lost hair will grow back. This experience shocked me so much that I will go the SARMs route. I don't want to risk anything. It is always much better to keep hair than to regrow hair back. By the way, research indicates that SARMs like S1 or S4 behave like antagonists of DHT in the prostate, and S1 even showed similar results in suppressing prostate weight like finasteride! These results would indicate that taking SARMs shouldn't be harmful for hair, but, to the contrary, beneficial! But these were lab tests on rats. In humans, it may work differently...

 

[Cassin]

Good thread!

 

[Quadzilla99]

What steroids did you take? I took Winstrol twice and I realized that it was an androgenic sh*t. Fortunately, minoxidil works so well in me that I had no problems with hair, although my face was covered with big red cysts. I have taken Anavar several times since that time, and it was O.K. Curiously, I even observed that it temporarily improved my chronical problems with seborrhea - it is so ludicrously a weak androgen! A gentle steroid!

In any case, Propecia (finasteride) won't do much against steroids - even against testosterone, because DHT levels increase dramatically. Minoxidil is the better option.

Ironically, the only time I experienced some loss of hair during the last 15 years was just this spring, after I stopped my experiments with 10-15% minoxidil. It really destroyed my hairline and I must hope that the lost hair will grow back. This experience shocked me so much that I will go the SARMs route. I don't want to risk anything. It is always much better to keep hair than to regrow hair back. By the way, research indicates that SARMs like S1 or S4 behave like antagonists of DHT in the prostate, and S1 even showed similar results in suppressing prostate weight like finasteride! These results would indicate that taking SARMs shouldn't be harmful for hair, but, to the contrary, beneficial! But these were lab tests on rats. In humans, it may work differently...

Its a long story but, I took superdrol first last year and was very wary of hair loss. Didn't lose a thing, and then nothing from m14add, so I didn't even research epistane/havoc as much as I did the first two and just figured that since it was a dht based compound like sd but weaker that if I didn't shed on sd I would be fine on havoc. I also figured that since I had experienced little hair loss since starting finasteride/nizoral 12 or so years ago that a short 4-6 week cycle couldn't really cause much hair loss. Boy was I wrong. Turns out even though superdrol has pretty bad overall in terms of side effects its pretty mild on the hair but epi/havoc is the source of a lot of horror stories.

Here's some links to read:

http://www.prohormoneforum.com/prohormone-forum/63660-hair-shedding-overrated.html#post1043709 (I post later on on that page)

Don't ever take that ****.

 

[Beingbaldsucksass]

People here were coght with the pants down trying to advertise hippy products and say finasteride kills your desire

 

[WarLord]

Its a long story but, I took superdrol first last year and was very wary of hair loss. Didn't lose a thing, and then nothing from m14add, so I didn't even research epistane/havoc as much as I did the first two and just figured that since it was a dht based compound like sd but weaker that if I didn't shed on sd I would be fine on havoc. I also figured that since I had experienced little hair loss since starting finasteride/nizoral 12 or so years ago that a short 4-6 week cycle couldn't really cause much hair loss. Boy was I wrong. Turns out even though superdrol has pretty bad overall in terms of side effects its pretty mild on the hair but epi/havoc is the source of a lot of horror stories.

Here's some links to read:

http://www.prohormoneforum.com/prohormone-forum/63660-hair-shedding-overrated.html#post1043709 (I post later on on that page)

Don't ever take that ****.

What do you mean by "a bunch of hair"? Did you lose your hair with the typical androgenic pattern (temples, vertex), or did you lose it diffusely on the whole scalp? Actually, it is interesting that most people on steroids report telogen effluvium (i.e. a sudden, extensive loss of hair that will come back after several months), not typical male pattern baldness. In any case, you risked a lot, because finasteride is very inflexible, as for the protection of hair. It can only protect you against DHT, not against other androgens. This means that when you were taking Superdrol, your hair was fully exposed to its effect. Minoxidil is much better in this regard. Furthermore, men with a risk of male pattern baldness should stay at steroids like Anavar and Deca. In the spring, I also lost "a bunch of hair" in my temple, which terrified me a lot, but paradoxicly, it was a consequence of minoxidil overdose (my unfortunate experiment with 10-15% minoxidil). I don't know, if the hair comes back, but I became so distressed from the possibility of new hairloss that I won't touch any steroid anymore. I will stay at SARMs.

 

[Quadzilla99]

What do you mean by "a bunch of hair"? Did you lose your hair with the typical androgenic pattern (temples, vertex), or did you lose it diffusely on the whole scalp? Actually, it is interesting that most people on steroids report telogen effluvium (i.e. a sudden, extensive loss of hair that will come back after several months), not typical male pattern baldness. In any case, you risked a lot, because finasteride is very inflexible, as for the protection of hair. It can only protect you against DHT, not against other androgens. This means that when you were taking Superdrol, your hair was fully exposed to its effect. Minoxidil is much better in this regard. Furthermore, men with a risk of male pattern baldness should stay at steroids like Anavar and Deca. In the spring, I also lost "a bunch of hair" in my temple, which terrified me a lot, but paradoxicly, it was a consequence of minoxidil overdose (my unfortunate experiment with 10-15% minoxidil). I don't know, if the hair comes back, but I became so distressed from the possibility of new hairloss that I won't touch any steroid anymore. I will stay at SARMs.

I knew finasteride would be ineffective when taking phs since your body shuts down its own production of test and a product such as superdrol already enters your body as DHT. In other words it is already 5 alpha reduced. I didn't take finasteride when I took superdrol or havoc. I figured that a short cycle wouldn't cause me much if any hair loss. I did a lot of research before my first two cycles...Even though superdrol is a DHT based compound is known to be pretty hairsafe. So with superdrol I had no averse hair effects...same with m14add which is also considered hairsafe. Its weird but even though a certain group of steroids may be dht based they can have widely varying effects on male pattern baldness. Then for my third cycle, I incorrectly assumed that havoc wouldn't be a problem either since although its also dht based its weaker in terms of its effects...at least on muscle growth/strength. If I had done my research I would have seen (like in those discussions I linked earlier) that its well known to rape hairlines. I experienced a pretty big shed from weeks four through six with a scalp itch like I have never experienced before in my life even while using nizoral 4-5x a week. I am out of PCT one week now and am hoping/assuming that I will have to regrow some of this hair. I can see my scalp all over the top of my head which I never could before (mainly had hair loss in the temples...classic widows peak) when I look at myself in the mirror under certain lights like in the bathroom next to the guest room in my house. I've read varying reports on people regrowing their hair after experiencing big sheds. Thing is all of my hair loss is in the typical male pattern baldness areas and it makes me think/assume this is where I would have lost it over the years if I had never treated my male pattern baldness.

- - - Updated - - -

As for my regimen I've added neutrogena t-gel greasy (2% salicylic acid and .75% piroctone olamine) and plan to take that 2-3x a week, nizoral 2x a week (washing my hair 4-5x a week total), and 1.25 finasteride almost every day. So the neutrogena is the new addition I've made since coming onto this forum/researching hair loss on the internet. I am a big fan of nizoral and have been taking that since the late 90s. I first read about it in the bb mag Muscle Media 2000 when a guy named Mike Mooney reported (in 1996) that some guys taking certain steroids stopped shedding completely when using it...obviously that didn't work for me on havoc guess it works better on other steroids. So I think its important to note that there were anecdotal reports of it working for hair loss before any of those six studies I linked ever came out. I am thinking that I will have to regrow some of this hair if I stay more strict in my nizoral regimen (over the years I would sometimes use it 2-3x a week and sometimes only use it once a week or once every two weeks depending upon finances...I would always have a bottle of 1 or 2% in the shower but I would try to make it last by using it sparingly or using a smalll amount since I read on McNeil's website that it lasts in therapeutic concentrations in the scalp for a week). But now I'm going to use a solid amount of the 2% 2x a week and leave it in my hair a good 5-10 minutes. I'm feeling pretty confident in the regimen I have now and just need to stick to this and should see some results in a couple of months I hope.

 

[Benjamin36]

I completely agree. No offense guys, but the only reason I joined here was because I'm going through a massive shed from finasteride. If everything was great, I likely wouldn't have signed up.

This theory is exactly what I was thinking, when you have a problem for the time that you have that problem the world stands still for you, but once that problem has been solved, you forget about it quickly.

 

[Quadzilla99]

BUMP...positive thread to keep people's spirits up

 

[Quadzilla99]

BUMP...positive thread to keep people's spirits up

Underrated post

 

[Audi]

My roommate in college in 05' was losing a decent amount of hair so he started lurking hairloss forums. He immediately got on propecia, some type of shampoo (nizoral?), and some topical DHT blocker (have no idea if that works or not). Anyways when we moved out about 11 months later his hair was pretty much back to normal. He posted his results on a hairloss forum (not sure which one but I bet the thread is somewhere out there) and he got a lot of positive comments and also quite a bit of negative ones. I remember him showing me his pm box: "nice hair, but have fun becoming a woman", "bull**** you work for Merck", even had a guy send him physical threats thinking they were bs pics. Obviously he never posted on there again and went on with his life. Haven't seen him in a few years but his hair looks fine on his facebook. I understand the risk for side effects is very real and I'm glad people with negative experiences are there to inform and support others. But to get angry and hateful at someone who had success with no side effects is just perplexing.

 

[Quadzilla99]

BUMP diggity to give some people perspective

 

[Quadzilla99]

...

 

[Notcoolanymore]

People will still gravitate toward the negative stuff. It's just the way it is. So many guys will never give themselves a chance to fight their hair loss.