New Dermaroller Study; Thoughts, comments?

[BeliefISKEY]

Seriously guys you are getting way ahead of yourselves, we dont really know how well this works, it has worked on a couple people so far. I am praying it does believe me but until 2young looks like his avatar its still an experiment. Myself and a few others have gone in reverse. Squeegee is coming off a major shed and until it all comes back and then some you cant say its a cure or even a great treatment. I am going to try glycolic acid this week To boost wounding . Its great that some are enthusiastic as it keeps me positive but give this a few more months to determine its effectiveness

Just keeping it real fellas, i really want my shed hair back x 50

For like the what, 100th time now? YOU ARE NOT GOING IN REVERSE. Until you fully understand hair loss as much as some of the pretty knowledgeable people on here PLEASE keep these comments to yourself. Guys that think shedding as a result of undergoing a legit hair restoration therapy should be considered as "going in reverse" shouldn't have a say in whether or not this therapy will be successful.

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no man i only speak english very little german and greek and maybe ancient greek,.... doesnt matter what we speak or where we come from what it matters is that we r gonna have hair.


[video=youtube;_HJkuihpHms]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_HJkuihpHms[/video]

squeeg we buy this for the clinic? guys look at this although it slices vertical and in an angle like the roller it looks an awesome tool for slicing dermal papilla b itches.

http://www.gblchina.com/ProductInfo...0&comp_stats=comp-FrontProduct_list-001.html# <---check this out

Awesome man... Search these 2 words up on google =>CULO CAGADO<= That's what I'm gonna have after I eat this taco bell

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Well it's done for motivation and fun, nobody cares what you think some people act like the own the board, go to another if your gonna be a crybaby and you are over exaggerating it's not that many videos posted you must not like rap that much. I like the videos because it makes people less uptight about hair loss. People are staying on subject besides arguments that somehow start because of dumb posts like yours

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Good to know someone else believes in the unseen, and don't care what that turd thinks. I believe 90% of hair loss is from lack of circulation! our hair is like the plants and it needs blood flow with nutrients to grow hair. Dermarolling gives best blood flow and activates ingredients.

Right! I personally believe lack of blood flow via tight scalp is the main cause and of course there are other factors involved AFTER that lack of blood flow occurs. Once you restore blood flow via loosening the galea or Dermarolling you can say bye bye to the other problems. That's usually the main cause for lots of disturbances in the body as well... Lack of blood flow.

Speaking of the unseen and blood flow, check this out https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=37454

Now you really know we're on the money with blood flow being 90% of this problem!

 

[saintsfan92344]

beliefiskey please dont respond to anything i say again, you cant seem to read thru anything, and you seem to have a holier than thou attitude. Acting like you have a say who can participate in the study. Professor Beliefiskey
i am just saying keep it real, but YOU dont know if my shed hair is coming back 100% it should but i know there is a chance it wont. Just block my posts and move on. There is always some that do not respond to treatments. If your treatments and ideas are so great why are you on a hairloss forum shouldnt you be writing a book or something.

 

[2young2retire]

belief in sky you must eat organic healthy stuff or you r gonna turn in sth like that you describe .dont eat this .... baldness should be your last problem. i can see a sodomazohistic sex disorder right there. see a counsellor before you treat your hair bro, i hope everything works out well.

greets

 

[BeliefISKEY]

beliefiskey please dont respond to anything i say again, you cant seem to read thru anything, and you seem to have a holier than thou attitude. i am just saying keep it real, you dont know if my shed hair is coming back 100% it should but i know there is a chance it wont. Just block my posts and move on. There is always some that do not respond to treatments. If your treatments and ideas are so great why are you on a hairloss forum shouldnt you be writing a book or something

"There is ajways some that don't respond to treatments".... Lol YOU'RE RESPONDING! This is exactly my point you don't know wtf you're talking about half the time.

Kid what are you saying? Please explain to me how inducing blood flow via wounding/remodeling the scalp is causing your hair to worsen... Explain to me why you might not recover from this shed? The shed= hairs starting to cycle properly again... It's cool that you're being "humble" but it's pointless when it comes from someone that is clearly uninformed & possibly misleading new people on here by saying you, as well as some others are regressing & getting worse when that's not even the case. We don't want new people to fear the shed because the shed is essential for the majority of people.

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belief in sky you must eat organic healthy stuff or you r gonna turn in sth like that you describe .dont eat this .... baldness should be your last problem. i can see a sodomazohistic sex disorder right there. see a counsellor before you treat your hair bro, i hope everything works out well.

greets

LOL nah man I was fuc**** around.... I eat mostly organic.

 

[damien_p_watermelon]

I have a question:

Am I reawakening sleeping or miniaturised follicles or am I making new ones?
I ask because I have always had very fine hair and am wondering if the areas that I have that haven't had any hair loss might get thicker than before.

 

[2young2retire]

both but more the reawaking

I have a question:

Am I reawakening sleeping or miniaturised follicles or am I making new ones?
I ask because I have always had very fine hair and am wondering if the areas that I have that haven't had any hair loss might get thicker than before.

 

[BeliefISKEY]

I have a question:

Am I reawakening sleeping or miniaturised follicles or am I making new ones?
I ask because I have always had very fine hair and am wondering if the areas that I have that haven't had any hair loss might get thicker than before.

Reawakening.... To me it sounds like you may have a pretty weak vascular system if you are in fact correct about your hair being naturally fine & getting thicker now that you're Dermarolling... Makes sense. Not too much of a problem though.

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both but more the reawaking

How making new ones 2 young?

 

[saintsfan92344]

"There is ajways some that don't respond to treatments".... Lol YOU'RE RESPONDING! This is exactly my point you don't know wtf you're talking about half the time.

Kid what are you saying? Please explain to me how inducing blood flow via wounding/remodeling the scalp is causing your hair to worsen... Explain to me why you might not recover from this shed? The shed= hairs starting to cycle properly again... It's cool that you're being "humble" but it's pointless when it comes from someone that is clearly uninformed & possibly misleading new people on here by saying you, as well as some others are regressing & getting worse when that's not even the case. We don't want new people to fear the shed because the shed is essential for the majority of people.

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LOL nah man I was fuc**** around.... I eat mostly organic.

Are you and Fredthebelgian the same person, damn ur right its all good, I shouldnt say whats really happening we will all respond like 2young with no sheds. Then someone new comes on and sees that and freak out like he is the only one shedding.
I am a realist, i consider all possibilities good and bad. The simple truth is this is an experiment YOU are no more informed than anyone else despite what you believe LOL. You are on an alternative treatments forum for gods sake. It isnt a 100% proven treatment. I am doing an experiment on my head like everyone else here, stating whats happening and yes I am shedding a whole lot and if i feel like saying it again i will. Once again this is an experiment, we hope it will work and keep working.
I will keep rolling like the study and keep stating my progress both good and bad,and you can keep insulting people that dont have your same thought process. if it works great if not I am off to the next great thing, maybe I will get really desperate and try the violet ray, thats a proven treatment

 

[opti]

Why we have to use minoxidil , my explanation :
minoxidil inhibits tgf beta. What does TGF do ?
It decreases cell Proliferation and dont let cells differenciate To hair cells.
It also DECREASES scarring after wounding .
Dht also leads to more tgf beta ( making some sense now?).
Thats why i guess its urgent to boost DRing with minoxidil.

Posting studies tommorow

 

[Haircules]

I am a realist, i consider all possibilities good and bad.

Good!

The simple truth is this is an experiment

Yes!

YOU are no more informed than anyone else despite what you believe LOL.

Yes!

You are on an alternative treatments forum for gods sake.

Yes!

It isnt a 100% proven treatment.

Yes!

Plus:
Results of 2y2r don't fully count since he has only started minoxidil + we don't see him with the same hair-length as before the experiment + we don't know what will be in 2 years after minoxidil-effects normally decrease - (on the other hand i am really impressed by the results of PrettyFly)

And people can keep on posting studies as much as they want - as long as there is no every day use for it, it's no treatment.

And if BelieveSKEY follows his own orders(!) "Until you fully understand hair loss as much as some of the pretty knowledgeable people on here PLEASE keep these comments to yourself" - he shall keep his comments to himself aswell :-D There is no man on earth who fully understands hair loss, full stop.

 

[saintsfan92344]

Good!


Yes!


Yes!


Yes!


Yes!

Plus:
Results of 2y2r don't fully count since he has only started minoxidil + we don't see him with the same hair-length as before the experiment + we don't know what will be in 2 years after minoxidil-effects normally decrease - (on the other hand i am really impressed by the results of PrettyFly)

And people can keep on posting studies as much as they want - as long as there is no every day use for it, it's no treatment.

And if BelieveSKEY follows his own orders(!) "Until you fully understand hair loss as much as some of the pretty knowledgeable people on here PLEASE keep these comments to yourself" - he shall keep his comments to himself aswell :-D There is no man on earth who fully understands hair loss, full stop.

Thank you. I am not the first person he started this crap with. Hes an internet tough guy.

As far as 2young i do think i see results. Plus his attitude is very positive along with squeegee most of the time
And that is good for everyone

 

[squeegee]

Adhesion is kind of like fibrosis. It says that DHT causes an increase in adhesion of the vascular system. Theoretically the high DHT in the scalp increases adhesion of the scalp's vascular system.

Bingo!

[h=1]Increased monocyte adhesion by endothelial expression of VCAM-1 missense variation in vitro.[/h]Schmitz B, Vischer P, Brand E, Schmidt-Petersen K, Korb-Pap A, Guske K, Nedele J, Schelleckes M, Hillen J, Rötrige A, Simmet T, Paul M, Cambien F, Brand SM.
[h=3]Author information [/h]

• University Hospital Münster, Institute of Sports Medicine, Molecular Genetics of Cardiovascular Disease, Horstmarer Landweg 39, D-48149 Münster, Germany; University Hospital Münster, Internal Medicine D, Nephrology, Hypertension and Rheumatology, Münster, Germany.

[h=3]Abstract[/h][h=4]OBJECTIVE:[/h]In whole genome and single gene analyses, genetic variation at the vascular cell adhesion molecule-1 (VCAM-1) locus has been associated with inflammatory disease and stroke in sickle cell anaemia. In the current work, we investigated the functional impact of VCAM-1 missense variants and their effect on cell-cell adhesion.
[h=4]METHODS AND RESULTS:[/h]To determine the functional in vitro relevance of five missense VCAM-1 variants (S318F; T384A; G413A; L555V; I716L), we generated wild type and single variant VCAM-1 forms [318F, 384A, 413A, 555V, 716L] in EA.hy926 endothelial cells. Real-time PCR, western blot and ELISA analyses revealed significant differences in mRNA and protein levels for VCAM-1 variants. Monocytic cell lines THP-1 and U937 showed significantly increased adhesion to endothelial cells overexpressing VCAM-1 forms 318F, 555V and 716L compared to those overexpressing wild type VCAM-1 (p < 0.05).
[h=4]CONCLUSIONS:[/h]VCAM-1-dependent cell adhesion to endothelial cells in vitro is significantly increased when expressing VCAM-1 missense mutations 318F, 555V and 716L. The underlying mechanism involves altered VCAM-1 protein levels and function. This observation may be of particular relevance for chronic inflammatory pathophysiologic conditions involving cell-cell adhesion such as atherosclerosis and other proinflammatory conditions.

Copyright © 2013 Elsevier Ireland Ltd. All rights reserved.








Microvascular insufficiency and local tissue hypoxia (male pattern baldness)

1: Med Hypotheses 2002 Apr;58(4):261-3

Hormone-induced aberrations in electromagnetic adhesion signaling as a developmental factor of androgenetic alopecia.

Matilainen VA, Keinanen-Kiukaanniemi SM.

Department of Public Health Science and General Practice, University of Oulu, Finland.

In androgenetic alopecia, overactivation of the androgen hormone cascade in genetically predisposed persons leads to miniaturization of the dermal papilla of the hair follicle and to reduction in the number of papilla cells in the scalp, but the mechanisms explaining this miniaturization have remained unclear. According to our hypothesis, the increase of dihydrotestosterone (DHT) production in the overactive androgen state inhibits cell mitosis in the dermal papilla and contributes to the induction of programmed cell death (apoptosis). Normally, DNA molecules have a negative charge, which doubles in every cell mitosis. In the catagen and telogen phases, the sulphur-rich hair moves upwards, dehydrates and develops an increasing positive charge. In a normal hair-growth cycle, the epithelial column shortens and the secondary germ is formed and it invaginates the dermal papilla by electromagnetic attraction. In the mitotic inhibition state induced by DHT, the negative charge decreases, leading to a weakening of the electromagnetic adhesion forces and weaker electrical attraction between the undifferentiated germ cells and the dermal papilla. Insulin resistance has an additional pathogenic role in the excessive miniaturization of the hair follicle. The vasoactive substances associated with endothelial dysfunction in insulin resistance induce microcirculatory disturbance, perifollicular vasoconstriction and stimulation of smooth muscle cell proliferation in the vascular wall. This leads to microvascular insufficiency and local tissue hypoxia and progressive miniaturization of hair follicles.


1: Plast Reconstr Surg 1996 May;97(6)1109-16; discussion 1117

Transcutaneous PO2 of the scalp in male pattern baldness: a new piece to the puzzle.

Goldman BE, Fisher DM, Ringler SL.

Department of Plastic Surgery, Butterworth Hospital, Grand Rapids, Mich., USA.

Our study was designed to measure the transcutaneous PO2 of the scalp to determine if there was a relative microvascular insufficiency and associated tissue hypoxia in areas of hair loss in male pattern baldness. A controlled prospective study was performed at Butterworth Hospital, Grand Rapids, Michigan. Eighteen nonsmoking male volunteers aged 18 years and older were studied. Nine men had male pattern baldness (Juri degree II or III), and nine were controls (no male pattern baldness). Scalp temperature and transcutaneous PO2 were obtained at frontal and temporal sites in each subject. Peripheral circulation was assessed from postocclusive transcutaneous PO2 recovery time by means of maximum initial slope measurements. Statistical significance was assessed at p < 0.05. There was no significant difference in scalp temperature between male pattern baldness subjects and controls. Temporal scalp blood flow was significantly higher than frontal scalp blood flow in male pattern baldness subjects; however, there was no significant difference in controls. Transcutaneous PO2 was significantly lower in bald frontal scalp (32.2 +/- 2.0 mmHg) than in hair-bearing temporal scalp (51.8 +/- 4.4 mmHg) in men with male pattern baldness. In controls, there was no significant difference in transcutaneous PO2 of frontal scalp (53.9 +/- 3.5 mmHg) and temporal scalp (61.4 +/- 2.7 mmHg). Transcutaneous PO2 also was significantly lower in the frontal scalp of male pattern baldness subjects (32.2 +/- 2.0 mmHg) than in either frontal or temporal scalp of controls (53.9 +/- 3.5 mmHg and 61.4 +/- 2.7 mmHg, respectively). There is a relative microvascular insufficiency to regions of the scalp that lose hair in male pattern baldness. We have identified a previously unreported tissue hypoxia in bald scalp compared with hair-bearing scalp.
​

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squegee btw did you try those growth factors? (those litle bottles someone once posted here and you said that you bought some) any expirience? and gief pics!!!

Dunno man! I just mixed them with minoxidil LOL.. Stick to the derma roller!!

 

[BeliefISKEY]

Are you and Fredthebelgian the same person, damn ur right its all good, I shouldnt say whats really happening we will all respond like 2young with no sheds. Then someone new comes on and sees that and freak out like he is the only one shedding.
I am a realist, i consider all possibilities good and bad. The simple truth is this is an experiment YOU are no more informed than anyone else despite what you believe LOL. You are on an alternative treatments forum for gods sake. It isnt a 100% proven treatment. I am doing an experiment on my head like everyone else here, stating whats happening and yes I am shedding a whole lot and if i feel like saying it again i will. Once again this is an experiment, we hope it will work and keep working.
I will keep rolling like the study and keep stating my progress both good and bad,and you can keep insulting people that dont have your same thought process. if it works great if not I am off to the next great thing, maybe I will get really desperate and try the violet ray, thats a proven treatment

Whether you're being sarcastic or not, the violet ray is awesome.

I never said I was more experienced on this particular experiment than anyone else... I'm talking about the hair cycles you genius. Are you like held back mentally or something? You are saying you are regressing and I'm pretty sure you've been told already that it's a good sign instead of a bad one. Again, stop misleading people. Idgaf what you do besides that. We can squash this now this is a waste of forum.

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Good!

Another one lol




Yes!


Yes!


Yes!


Yes!

Plus:
Results of 2y2r don't fully count since he has only started minoxidil + we don't see him with the same hair-length as before the experiment + we don't know what will be in 2 years after minoxidil-effects normally decrease - (on the other hand i am really impressed by the results of PrettyFly)

And people can keep on posting studies as much as they want - as long as there is no every day use for it, it's no treatment.

And if BelieveSKEY follows his own orders(!) "Until you fully understand hair loss as much as some of the pretty knowledgeable people on here PLEASE keep these comments to yourself" - he shall keep his comments to himself aswell :-D There is no man on earth who fully understands hair loss, full stop.

Tell me Captain Nutsack, where in that response did I claim I FULLY understood hair loss? Nowhere... We can drop this now.

 

[squeegee]

Good!


Yes!


Yes!


Yes!


Yes!

Plus:
Results of 2y2r don't fully count since he has only started minoxidil + we don't see him with the same hair-length as before the experiment + we don't know what will be in 2 years after minoxidil-effects normally decrease - (on the other hand i am really impressed by the results of PrettyFly)

And people can keep on posting studies as much as they want - as long as there is no every day use for it, it's no treatment.

And if BelieveSKEY follows his own orders(!) "Until you fully understand hair loss as much as some of the pretty knowledgeable people on here PLEASE keep these comments to yourself" - he shall keep his comments to himself aswell :-D There is no man on earth who fully understands hair loss, full stop.

The derma-roller is not really a "treatment" You are actually remodeling the scalp.. There is a physical change to it.. It is call an actual surgery in clinics.. It is not minoxidil..or daily pill your are taking.. you are actually rehabilitating the scalp back to his healthy functions.. by promoting angiogenesis.. you are increasing the microvascularity and getting rid of the actual fibrosis.. Same **** is happening with cardiovascular problems.. Its start with monocytes adhesion, inflammation of the endothelium.. wall of the arteries.. then vascular remodeling by fibrosis.. it is just done to a bigger scale.

 

[Finco]

Hi all,

I'm a long time lurker of these forums and this thread in particularly. Just wanted to say I appreciate all the work you guys are putting into this squeegee etc. I've never seen a thread with so much scientific studies and sources being presented to back up arguments and ideas regarding this, its great thing to see!

I've struggled with 'hair loss' for a long time and I started 'dermarolling' 12 weeks ago now. Im not going to say I've had success or not that up to you guys to decide. Here are some pictures so far, let me know what you guys think.



Diffuse thinning

0.5mg Finasteride was used, daily, and using Minoxidil, twice per day, 7 months prior to this, with limited to no results.

Used ketoconazole shampoo as well as minoxidil twice a day.

192 needle roller, 1.5mm.

 

[CursedMen]

For people saying the only reason you are getting results with rolling is due to the minoxidil, you have forgot about the several examples of people getting scars on the body and around those scars thicker hairs. Obviously that has nothing to do with minoxidil. I'm not saying minoxidil doesn't improve the results, but to say it is a must is wrong. I'll be ordering 1.5 mm roller next week or so, and I'm not going to be using minoxidil.
On another note, no company is going to solve the problem of hair loss. It is going to come from forums like this. We all need to help each other out, support one another, and quit arguing. Just remember, where there is a will there is a way.

 

[squeegee]

For people saying the only reason you are getting results with rolling is due to the minoxidil, you have forgot about the several examples of people getting scars on the body and around those scars thicker hairs. Obviously that has nothing to do with minoxidil. I'm not saying minoxidil doesn't improve the results, but to say it is a must is wrong. I'll be ordering 1.5 mm roller next week or so, and I'm not going to be using minoxidil.
On another note, no company is going to solve the problem of hair loss. It is going to come from forums like this. We all need to help each other out, support one another, and quit arguing. Just remember, where there is a will there is a way.

Members saying that the actual results in this thread is attributed to minoxidil should stay lurker. Most of us on here had previous experience with minoxidil or finasteride.. etc.. It is insulting.

 

[saintsfan92344]

The derma-roller is not really a "treatment" You are actually remodeling the scalp.. There is a physical change to it.. It is call an actual surgery in clinics.. It is not minoxidil..or daily pill your are taking.. you are actually rehabilitating the scalp back to his healthy functions.. by promoting angiogenesis.. you are increasing the microvascularity and getting rid of the actual fibrosis.. Same **** is happening with cardiovascular problems.. Its start with monocytes adhesion, inflammation of the endothelium.. wall of the arteries.. then vascular remodeling by fibrosis.. it is just done to a bigger scale.

yes squeegee, we got that part but its still somewhat experimental and a theory, all of that may be happening but does it really regrow hair? that is what we are trying to find out Correct? I am not saying it doesn't work or wont work, I am hoping it will because in theory it sounds like it should and I am rolling and bleeding like everyone, Will it work for everyone? we don't know. everyone is acting like its a cant miss cure, The fact is WE don't know yet.
Certain people on here only want to hear or BELIEVE its going to work and jump on anyone that says otherwise, I believe you have to see the bad results along with the good to get an accurate idea, I know you are pretty knowledgeable but I look at every angle, I started shedding at 3 weeks, you started much later, 2young hasnt had one, some people have more hair than others and are affected differently, Those that don't know everything can learn from all of this, then there are those that know everything already and can go F#Ck themselves, some of us aren't very knowledgeable at all apparently and are very slow but are trying to be a part of something that can be great. That wasn't aimed at you squeegee just FYI


yes I was being sarcastic about the violet ray, you can insult people so here it is back at you, Who in there right mind would take that seriously, That right there told me all I needed to know about how knowledgeable you are, its right up there with the VITAMEATAVEGAMIN from I Love lucy, its quack science and probably fried your brain, NOW IM DONE

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I agree. I didn't have any results with minoxidil, and major sides with finasteride that's why I am trying this,

 

[squeegee]

yes squeegee, we got that part but its still somewhat experimental and a theory, all of that may be happening but does it really regrow hair? that is what we are trying to find out Correct? I am not saying it doesn't work or wont work, I am hoping it will because in theory it sounds like it should and I am rolling and bleeding like everyone, Will it work for everyone? we don't know. everyone is acting like its a cant miss cure, The fact is WE don't know yet.
Certain people on here only want to hear or BELIEVE its going to work and jump on anyone that says otherwise, I believe you have to see the bad results along with the good to get an accurate idea, I know you are pretty knowledgeable but I look at every angle, I started shedding at 3 weeks, you started much later, 2young hasnt had one, some people have more hair than others and are affected differently, Those that don't know everything can learn from all of this, then there are those that know everything already and can go F#Ck themselves, some of us aren't very knowledgeable at all apparently and are very slow but are trying to be a part of something that can be great. That wasn't aimed at you squeegee just FYI


yes I was being sarcastic about the violet ray, you can insult people so here it is back at you, Who in there right mind would take that seriously, That right there told me all I needed to know about how knowledgeable you are, its right up there with the VITAMEATAVEGAMIN from I Love lucy, its quack science and probably fried your brain, NOW IM DONE

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I agree. I didn't have any results with minoxidil, and major sides with finasteride that's why I am trying this,

We should focus on the results and not on the downfalls.. 2young2retire are great results. The hair are thick..like real hair. not minoxidil results hair, major differences. Shedding is actually a good sign that hair are coming at you! Even some infant go through shedding stages.. My shedding was bad as ****, I looked like a guy straight up from the Chernobyl disaster LOL.. but I stick with it and now seeing the benefits with almost 20 weeks in..

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[video=youtube;q348aNNtmr4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q348aNNtmr4[/video]

 

[Sparky4444]

...if you want something more than fuzzy vellus, you NEED minoxidil...period...

Got rogaine foam in today...going all in as needling only did nothing cosmetically...the best results are those who are using minoxidil and DR..period..