Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[2TameDHT]

I've been doing a lot of reading, on both Reddit and here.
Since I am planning to actually transition as non-binary/gender-fluid I choose to go the full HRT route from the beginning.

Noticing my hair thinning forced me to confront my dysphoria more seriously.
I presented solely as masculine because I didn't want to answer a lot of questions from small minded people from my family or hometown.
I was never completely happy with it, though not completely unhappy since I still felt the masculine side was one part of me, hence why I never felt like I was "born in the wrong body." Now I feel like I was born with the wrong androgens.

My dysphoria never got too serious, because I felt I could always look the way I wanted to look, I just had to have the confidence one day. It never occurred to me that I could go bald, even with my bald father. My hair thinning, coupled with the fact that I'm now in my 30's, I feel like I should not be "waiting" for some perfect condition to do the things I want since my youth is slowly coming to an end. I want to take control now.

I'm planning to start in Late summer/early fall.
The fact that I have written it in stone, I feel an investment in my body that I have never had before.
Now, I am planning a diet and exercise regimen so that I can have the healthiest, hottest body possible for my hair to thrive on top of.

 

[Norwoody]

I've been doing a lot of reading, on both Reddit and here.
Since I am planning to actually transition as non-binary/gender-fluid I choose to go the full HRT route from the beginning.

Noticing my hair thinning forced me to confront my dysphoria more seriously.
I presented solely as masculine because I didn't want to answer a lot of questions from small minded people from my family or hometown.
I was never completely happy with it, though not completely unhappy since I still felt the masculine side was one part of me, hence why I never felt like I was "born in the wrong body." Now I feel like I was born with the wrong androgens.

My dysphoria never got too serious, because I felt I could always look the way I wanted to look, I just had to have the confidence one day. It never occurred to me that I could go bald, even with my bald father. My hair thinning, coupled with the fact that I'm now in my 30's, I feel like I should not be "waiting" for some perfect condition to do the things I want since my youth is slowly coming to an end. I want to take control now.

I'm planning to start in Late summer/early fall.
The fact that I have written it in stone, I feel an investment in my body that I have never had before.
Now, I am planning a diet and exercise regimen so that I can have the healthiest, hottest body possible for my hair to thrive on top of.

Can you give us more specific details of your plans?

 

[2TameDHT]

Can you give us more specific details of your plans?

I've posted them earlier in the thread.

Right now, I plan to request 25-50 mg Bicalutamide, 6 mg E2 in the beginning.
After 3-6 months, I'll taper off of Bicalutamide and go up to 8 mg E2 Monotherapy, leaving the option of adding Progesterone after about 9-12 months.

 

[Norwoody]

I've posted them earlier in the thread.

Right now, I plan to request 25-50 mg Bicalutamide, 6 mg E2 in the beginning.
After 3-6 months, I'll taper off of Bicalutamide and go up to 8 mg E2 Monotherapy, leaving the option of adding Progesterone after about 9-12 months.

Wow, that is a lot of E2. In order to avoid feminization I would rather go with a high dose of bica and a low dose of E. However I'm sure your method will grow more hair.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

I've been doing a lot of reading, on both Reddit and here.
Since I am planning to actually transition as non-binary/gender-fluid I choose to go the full HRT route from the beginning.

Noticing my hair thinning forced me to confront my dysphoria more seriously.
I presented solely as masculine because I didn't want to answer a lot of questions from small minded people from my family or hometown.
I was never completely happy with it, though not completely unhappy since I still felt the masculine side was one part of me, hence why I never felt like I was "born in the wrong body." Now I feel like I was born with the wrong androgens.

My dysphoria never got too serious, because I felt I could always look the way I wanted to look, I just had to have the confidence one day. It never occurred to me that I could go bald, even with my bald father. My hair thinning, coupled with the fact that I'm now in my 30's, I feel like I should not be "waiting" for some perfect condition to do the things I want since my youth is slowly coming to an end. I want to take control now.

I'm planning to start in Late summer/early fall.
The fact that I have written it in stone, I feel an investment in my body that I have never had before.
Now, I am planning a diet and exercise regimen so that I can have the healthiest, hottest body possible for my hair to thrive on top of.

My feelings are quite similar. Some days I feel much more male and others more female. But my hair was the link between my non-binary selves. It's a hard thing being non-binary and feeling as though I have to always explain things to strangers instead of just being who I am.

I have deliberately pushed at times my delving into more stereotypical female interests and clothing because to a certain extent, what's the point of being non-binary otherwise. I think that I am more attractive as a female with a wig and more attractive as a guy without one but as my hair length increases, that might just essentially eliminate my main way of categorizing what are in many ways, two different personalities both of whom I have affection for and both of whom will always merit having a name. @bridgeburn talked about these things but not so much and not as someone out as non-binary even though virtually everyone seemed to view him that way.

I have been aware of the intense psychological aspects from day one of using OTC menopausal creams on my hair and feeling positively subversive. People claimed for years that such OTC products couldn't effectuate results and yet they did, which just drew me in further even though my hair results were the least apparent of all for a very long time. I have tried to write about these things honestly as are you because they can be a mind-f*** so guys need to know what they are getting into. Some times, I wish that I had told my family that I had an endocrine disorder which baldness certainly qualifies for, just because some times trans folks think everyone wants to know the truth and the whole story but on here, I made a decision to try to be non-PC and blatantly honest about all aspects.

Using HRT meds for hair loss essentially for life is not some much a difficult decision because of permanent feminization. It's all of the other gender baggage that most of us have stopped paying attention to that smacks you in the face. Inevitably, I am not sure how it can be "all right" to do this for hair and yet, have it be outside the bounds, to wear dresses or use makeup if we want to but most of our families prefer not to know and so for many, particularly staring out, I recommend caution about linking using HRT for hair loss purposes with being transgender. Nobody needs an excuse now that the gatekeepers are gone, to justify using HRT for hair or face or any other purpose. MtF's who strongly and unequivocally are female are different in this aspect but I think that more and more people who are at least androgynous cis-males are going to be opting to present with hair, regardless of other body effects since most of those can be obscured and have far less effect on being perceived as attractive.

Janey

 

[HelpMyHair!!]

Anybody have a recommendation on which Estrogen to use, and how much to add to Finasteride? This thread is confusing, bi-estro, estrogel, oestrogen, buccal, sublingual, etc etc.

On finasteride 1mg ED right now, don't want start minoxidil, unless it's a last resort. Looking for a recommendation on a good starting dose of topical E, and exactly which type/brand if possible?

finasteride is working/stabilizing me, but I need to add something (not min) to try and stimulate more growth.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Anybody have a recommendation on which Estrogen to use, and how much to add to Finasteride? This thread is confusing, bi-estro, estrogel, oestrogen, buccal, sublingual, etc etc.

On finasteride 1mg ED right now, don't want start minoxidil, unless it's a last resort. Looking for a recommendation on a good starting dose of topical E, and exactly which type/brand if possible?

finasteride is working/stabilizing me, but I need to add something (not min) to try and stimulate more growth.

It is confusing because we know that this can work. We just don't know what parameters matter and which don't, or even which might help some but not be worth the hassle. Using Estrogel is more expensive and for some, a hassle to apply and it is very difficult to prove that it works better than just using pills but most of us, I think believe that Estrogel, i.e., topicals, adds a least some improvement. I have cut way back on Estrogel because I was running out of balding areas to apply it to so now I mostly use on the hairline and I have more confidence in using other methods like the patch. Finasteride, most agree, barring sides that are intolerable is not optional if you want to do this effectively especially while your estrogen levels build up.

What we don't appear to know and what I go back and forth on, is whether improvement via HRT is gradual and incremental and based upon constant titration upwards to cis-female adult target levels or whether topical estrogen improves hair and hair counts immediately. It does something immediately and it was enough to keep me in the game and trying but I am more so convinced now that for people who want life-changing regrowth, HRT works like a light switch for regrowth and primarily and only, after adult female targets of E and T are met and maintained over time. This process is about as slow as watching hair grow itself and it can take years to see improvement but I also have seen claims of incredible improvement in six to nine months among younger folks with less hair loss.

I do think that when HRT works, it works for everyone and age is only faintly a negative but accumulated fibrosis might be a major hindrance. finasteride works against this so it is a major part of what we aim to accomplish.

Welcome,
Janey

 

[HelpMyHair!!]

It is confusing because we know that this can work. We just don't know what parameters matter and which don't, or even which might help some but not be worth the hassle. Using Estrogel is more expensive and for some, a hassle to apply and it is very difficult to prove that it works better than just using pills but most of us, I think believe that Estrogel, i.e., topicals, adds a least some improvement. I have cut way back on Estrogel because I was running out of balding areas to apply it to so now I mostly use on the hairline and I have more confidence in using other methods like the patch. Finasteride, most agree, barring sides that are intolerable is not optional if you want to do this effectively especially while your estrogen levels build up.

What we don't appear to know and what I go back and forth on, is whether improvement via HRT is gradual and incremental and based upon constant titration upwards to cis-female adult target levels or whether topical estrogen improves hair and hair counts immediately. It does something immediately and it was enough to keep me in the game and trying but I am more so convinced now that for people who want life-changing regrowth, HRT works like a light switch for regrowth and primarily and only, after adult female targets of E and T are met and maintained over time. This process is about as slow as watching hair grow itself and it can take years to see improvement but I also have seen claims of incredible improvement in six to nine months among younger folks with less hair loss.

I do think that when HRT works, it works for everyone and age is only faintly a negative but accumulated fibrosis might be a major hindrance. finasteride works against this so it is a major part of what we aim to accomplish.

Welcome,
Janey

Thank you Janey, I appreciate the reply and your contributions to this forum!

Basically, I'm a Norwood 2.5 at 37. Some recession, and minor crown thinning, but no slick bald areas (except temples before finasteride)

Finasteride has thickened existing hair, regrown some on my crown, and I've gotten a ton of small vellus hair on the hairline/temples. I feel like its gotten me, let's say 30% of where I would like to be.

What I am curious about, and would like to experiment with.....can I continue finasteride, and hit it hard with Estrogen only for a while without going "all in" with Bica, Cypro, or spironolactone.

All speculation, but I feel like for me personally, finasteride has "balanced me out" somewhat, but not quite enough to get those tiny vellus hairs to regrow significantly. My thought is, if I could significantly raise my estrogen levels, to the point where it lowers T slightly, it may put me right in the wheelhouse of where I need to be (again, just me personally).

What estrogel did you/do you use? Are you able to point me in the right direction? Naturally, I'm totally aware of the risks.

Thanks again for any guidance!

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Thank you Janey, I appreciate the reply and your contributions to this forum!

Basically, I'm a Norwood 2.5 at 37. Some recession, and minor crown thinning, but no slick bald areas (except temples before finasteride)

Finasteride has thickened existing hair, regrown some on my crown, and I've gotten a ton of small vellus hair on the hairline/temples. I feel like its gotten me, let's say 30% of where I would like to be.

What I am curious about, and would like to experiment with.....can I continue finasteride, and hit it hard with Estrogen only for a while without going "all in" with Bica, Cypro, or spironolactone.

All speculation, but I feel like for me personally, finasteride has "balanced me out" somewhat, but not quite enough to get those tiny vellus hairs to regrow significantly. My thought is, if I could significantly raise my estrogen levels, to the point where it lowers T slightly, it may put me right in the wheelhouse of where I need to be (again, just me personally).

What estrogel did you/do you use? Are you able to point me in the right direction? Naturally, I'm totally aware of the risks.

Thanks again for any guidance!

Thank you Janey, I appreciate the reply and your contributions to this forum!

Basically, I'm a Norwood 2.5 at 37. Some recession, and minor crown thinning, but no slick bald areas (except temples before finasteride)

Finasteride has thickened existing hair, regrown some on my crown, and I've gotten a ton of small vellus hair on the hairline/temples. I feel like its gotten me, let's say 30% of where I would like to be.

What I am curious about, and would like to experiment with.....can I continue finasteride, and hit it hard with Estrogen only for a while without going "all in" with Bica, Cypro, or spironolactone.

All speculation, but I feel like for me personally, finasteride has "balanced me out" somewhat, but not quite enough to get those tiny vellus hairs to regrow significantly. My thought is, if I could significantly raise my estrogen levels, to the point where it lowers T slightly, it may put me right in the wheelhouse of where I need to be (again, just me personally).

What estrogel did you/do you use? Are you able to point me in the right direction? Naturally, I'm totally aware of the risks.

Thanks again for any guidance!

If I understand correctly, I started out doing what you mention but I was on minoxidil too. The problem was that I started visibly feminizing everywhere except above the neck basically. My hair growth improved some but the copious regrowth started after I raised my estrogen levels far above those of adult cis-females and added oral minoxidil for some extra kick. I used brand name Oestrogel and bought it off-shore. I think the reason why HRT isn't a thing for males for hair regrowth is because you have to use more than most males could conceive of using and having it go systemic. The topical aspect probably helps so though so that's why it is difficult to give entirely straightforward answers. I will check back tomorrow. It is a fascinating topic. Thanks for the kind words.

Janey

 

[Almas]

If he adds bicalutamide, he wouldn’t have to worry about the adrenal glands producing testosterone. Even then, the amount of hormones aren’t enough to lead to hair loss, especially since the amount of DHT will be minimised drastically.

Hmm...

 

[Almas]

Why would he get Addison's disease? I mean, bicalutamide won't be stopping the adrenal glands from producing hormones, it will be blocking the androgen receptors in the hair follicles so androgens can't have an effect.

 

[Pls_NW-1]

Hmm...

We talk about PCOS-male syndrom in mans. Surely, in "normal" males bica won't be a problem. But we do not know how Bicalutamide will work on men having problems with adrenal androgens

 

[Almas]

We talk about PCOS-male syndrom in mans. Surely, in "normal" males bica won't be a problem. But we do not know how Bicalutamide will work on men having problems with adrenal androgens

My arms drop when I realize that even my mother is going bald

 

[Pls_NW-1]

My arms drop when I realize that even my mother is going bald

Yeah and my dick flies off lol :'( this sh*t is cursed.

 

[Almas]

what is the best type of estradiol to try? @Ikarus @keepcoolmybabies @Deacr4

I am 19 I have been on bicalutamide 100mg and dutasteride 0.5mg and im still losing ground

should I try progynova or estradiol valerate or estrace or estradiol hemihydrate?

I ordered estrace, will that work more or less effectively than other forms of estradiol?

SHEEEEEEEEEIIIT

 

[Almas]

My optimism has dropped. I have read all the posts about Bicalutamide on this forum. And I concluded that it helps 50% of people at best. But it is still better than 0% finasteride in young people

 

[mrdavies]

My optimism has dropped. I have read all the posts about Bicalutamide on this forum. And I concluded that it helps 50% of people at best. But it is still better than 0% finasteride in young people

That's not true.

 

[Almas]

That's not true.

Show me one person under the age of 20 who stopped baldness with finasteride and improved density at least a little

 

[mrdavies]

Show me one person under the age of 20 who stopped baldness with finasteride and improved density at least a little

There's tonnes of evidence that finasteride helps hair loss at people of that age. I'm unsure if you're just trolling or not.

 

[Pls_NW-1]

There's tonnes of evidence that finasteride helps hair loss at people of that age. I'm unsure if you're just trolling or not.

It's less likely Finasteride will help severe hairloss as much as it would help mild hairloss. Most late teens won't be able to hold as much as a middle-aged man with onset of male pattern baldness would be.