I honestly dont know what to do anymore....

karlg

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I don't think i have a normal case of MBP, or at least i don't think that's the whole problem.

Every single treatment ive tried has not worked, or it's worked SO poorly it wasn't worth continuing.

The reason i dont think my case is normal is:

my hair isn't just falling out, then growing back a bit finer, a full strand of hair (thick, at least 15 cm long, and cut, so not tapered) can fall out, and then grow back at a tiny vellus hair, there is no middle ground, no progress, just instant death. Now at that rate i should be bald completely by now but im not, because this does not seem to be the case with every hair.

Secondly, my hair changes colour alot, i naturally have a medium brown hair colour, used to dye it black, but last time i did that was 2 years ago, so i know there is no dyed hair on my head. Some hairs will grow back really fine, but are pitch black, nearly every strand of my hair when it falls out, seems to transition rapidly (and randomly, not in this order) between black, brown, and transparent (not grey, but completely clear). Nearly every hair ends in this transparent state, and it's not like they are thin hairs, even my thick still healthy hair (before it falls and dies ofc) goes transparent, i can run these hairs across the back of my hand and see them change colour, when it gets to the transparent bits of the hair, i cant even see it, despite the fact that this is the case even with thick hairs.

At the beginning of 2010 it wasn't SO bad, at least not like it is now. But about half way through February, within the space of 2 weeks or so, i lost nearly 50% of my hair, i went from thinning just on the top and slightly around the hairline to thinning all over, to all over thinning, and even more so around the typical area you would loose hair, i used to have next to no chest hair, and within 3 weeks i was covered with it, all over my back, shoulders, and chest, they grow in really thick and black, and the pigmentation of my arm and leg hair became lighter. Hair started growing over the backs of my hands. Keep in mind i had not changed anything in my life around this time, i put on loads of fat around my belly, got man boobs (which despite improved diet, and hours of exercise per day, after weeks i still couldn't get rid of them). the pores in the skin on my face became much more visible, and my skin went from soft, young skin to old man, wrinkly and dry skin, even the colour of my facial hair varies between brown and transparent, just not black (unlike with my head hair).

I started feeling weak, fatigued, and shaking all the time, and this still happens today, i can sleep too little, the right amount, or too much and when i wake up im so tired i could (and do) just go straight back to sleep for like, 8 hours.

around about the same time, my kidneys used to burn and ache, 24/7, i had a stinging pain in my liver, and a weird 'lump', for a lack of a better word, in my bowls that i could feel.

keep in mind, all of this happened within the space of about 2-3 weeks of all of this starting..... such an extreme change in such a short period of time seems wierd, i know ur metabolism slows as u get older, but going from full pelt to the equivalent of an old mans metabolism in what must have been days seems strange.



after about 8 months the liver and kidney pain started to fade, and by the start of 2011, it was more or less gone, although it does still happen some days for no aparant reason. The pain in my bowels finished fading away about a month later, but i can feel it every time the 'poop' passes that point, all around that area i can feel stuff moving through my guts really vividly, unlike the rest of my digestive system, and poop seems to `back up` at this point, i can feel it there for days before it finally `comes out`.


Anyway, ive seen several doctors at several surgeries and not a single one has helped me, they take one look at me, dont run any tests, no checks, nothing, and just tell me "get over it, its all in your head, deal with it and move on", or "just do a bit more exercise", and "the kidney, liver and bowl pain is perfectly normal, nothing to worry about". I ask for specific blood tests, complain about serious symptoms and the best response ive had is "We wont do these tests, because it's a waste of the NHS's money, and im sure your perfectly fine".... The only medication ive received at all has been something to stop heartburn, which isnt even a symptom, and all those pills did is flare up the pain in my kidneys and liver again (which i told them, and they just didn't acknowledged it, let alone even bother writing it down)


So there is no chance of help from doctors etc.... i have no idea what's goin on, and now im left in the position where ive requested a copy of my medical history, and i'll just have to treat it myself.

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Psychologically, it's destroyed me, i used to be a lively, youthful, fun loving person, whereas now i have no friends, no family, im pissed off all the time, i *hate* having to deal with anyone face to face, im bitter, become insanely shallow, aggressive, and nothing of the person that i was.

Ive completely given up on all my dreams and passions, and the only thing i do 24/7 is work on things which i plan to make alot of money out of, not for the sake of being a successful person, but so i can buy a house in the middle of nowhere, and just lock myself away for the rest of my life.

Ive lost all interest in women, in fact, i'd go as far as to say i genuinely hate most them, and i mean a very real hate, that you can feel come from the pit of ur stomach, sort of hate..... and i know it's completely un-justified, ive never even so much as spoken to these people, but it's like an instant reaction, and the only thing i can base it on is over the past 4 years women have done *nothing* but cause me pain.

Ive completely cut ties with my family, and my friends, and changed my job from a stable high income to a shakey, not so reliable income, just so i can work at home because i can't stand to be around people any more, im 23 years old and never, not once in my life have i seen a bald dude the same age as me, my hair problem just screams that i have significant genetic deficiencies, and that im a useless, un-viril male.

ive stopped going out drinking on the weekends, and instead just sit at home on my own with a bottle of vodka, get trashed, and sleep all through Saturday.

this has a huge impact on my life, and all of it started after the start of 2010, and the doctors (who are paid for by OUR taxes here in england btw), just don't care, wont help, and are simply not interested in what i have to say, and this fact they make very clear.





I honestly dont know what to do now, ive already accepted the rest of my life will be a miserable train wreck, and that things will NOT get better, but im sure the hair thing isnt `just in my head`, as those incompetent, negligent c**** seem to believe. ive gone through a substantial physical / chemical change, and it does not show any sign of improving, yet i cant get any help or medicine or even just a doctor to let their egotistical pride go 5 minutes of his time, and just listen to what i have to say, and run a few blood tests.

over the past 4 years ive paid something like just under 18k in national insurance, yet a few blood tests are a `waste of money`, the fuckin cheek of it, i think they've made a disgusting amount of profit out of me, and when i finally go to use what that money was for, they just sh*t on me and kick me out the door

Does anyone have any insight or opinions in regards to the hair situation, because i don't think it's normal, and the extra weight, kidney,liver,and bowel pain, skin, fatigue, etc... im convinced is related as all of it happened around the same time (2 weeks difference at the most).

What can i do from here, where do i go, and what should i be looking into, and what drugs if any may help? im obviously going to have to attempt to medicate and fix myself, and im not askin for someone to say "take this" then i go out, with the intention to get my hands on it and start dropping it, but if you can say "this drug because of x,y,z and this is how it works" then i can go and research it, research what it's used to cure, and try to cross reference my research with symptoms etc.. that i have so i can get a better understanding of what's going on.
 

freakout

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within the space of 2 weeks or so, i lost nearly 50% of my hair
What exactly were you doing during those times and a week or two prior to that?
 

karlg

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absolutely nothing, just goin about my day to day life, wake up, goto work, come home, eat some dinner, work some more and sleep. then on the weekends go and get drunk on a fri / sat night or something. My pattern, lifestyle, etc... hadnt really changed for years prior...
 

freakout

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Do you mind stating your age, weight and height pls. Any added work load during those times?
 

karlg

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Age 23, started hair loss at 20, was very slow and minor in comparison to how it was after the start of 2010.

weight, not 100% sure, but between 11 and 11.5 stone i think
and height i dont know for certain either, but im between 5.5ft and 6ft.

Can i ask, what makes you think follicles are immune-privileged?
 

karlg

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oh and work load, no, it's been heavy since i started the job, the work load was stressfull to start with but i just got used to it. I dont think this is related to work tough because that had'nt changed in years either.
 

freakout

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A study by Jahoda in 1999 proved that follicles are indeed immune privileged. If there any immunological causes or responses, it could only happen around the follicles.

How physically active are you? What are your current treatments?
 

hairhoper

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Ignore freakout, he's a f*****g nutjob.

Every single treatment ive tried has not worked, or it's worked SO poorly it wasn't worth continuing.

I did read your full post, but either you didn't mention which treatments you used, or I missed it. What were they if you don't mind me asking?
 

freakout

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Hairhoper is a hired thug. I believe Merck/Propecia has something to do with it. Just take a look at his posts. You'll see.
 

hairhoper

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Conspiracy theories? Really? I wish someone would pay me to exercise common sense. Sigh. Every tossing thread someone comes in here asking for help and instead gets your bullshit questions and then some absolute tripe about drinking milk. Give it up you troll moron. Nobody wants to hear it.

Anyway, karlg very moving story, a lot of which I can relate to. I would obv recommend kicking the booze, boring as f*** I know but it could be the first step in improving your mood.

Also, I'm English too and managed to get a blood test easily, even just asking my GP for a private finasteride prescription, my Doctor suggested one immediately just to rule out other factors. I'm amazed you have such trouble getting a blood test. Have you considered going private?

Also to narrow down my previous question, if you used finasteride/dutasteride, how long did you use it for and what were the results?
 

freakout

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Finasteride will turn you into an old man. It causes unpredictable medical conditions which are only beginning to be realized.
 

karlg

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So does that mean, theoreticly at least, that you can transplant a follicle from someone else's head, and put it into your scalp, without the body rejecting it?

Treatments in the past,

RU, didnt work for me untill i upped it to 150mg per ml, and the 'growth' i got, im sure was just weakened hair that was regrowing in those areas. i have long hair too which makes aplication more difficult, and i needed at least 4ml to cover my head properly, at it's current price this just isnt a solution given the results i (may) have had.

Xandrox 15% w/ finasteride, this made me shed, with no gains, and it was like putting glue on ur head. I stopped this because of finasteride side effects

Propecia, tried twice, in 08 and 09, worst move i ever made, all it did was seriously speed up the process, and even after stopping, the progress of hair loss didnt slow down, gave me awfull sides, insane mood swings, serious deep depression for no good reason (although that dont seem so bad now), sex drive hit the floor, and it's never really come back, but i dont think that's 100% the propecia. This stuff is poison, and i think it's partially to blame for `kick starting` the whole thing...

Vitiamins and suppliments, christ i cant even remember them all, there must have been at least 20 or more at one point, off the top of my head, msm, biotin, niacin, vit a (also tried that retinol stuff from minoxidil.com), green tea, beta sitosoril, l-arganine, l-lynse, all the vitiamins especially the B ones, grape seed extract and more....

(current) nanogain - still use this for the sake of using it up, plus it's water based so it helps to clear some of the left over sh*t from other topicals.

(current) nanominox - currently using 2x daily on my hair line, and temples just to see if it works, prolly the best minoxidil ive used, but after more then 4 months, i have maybe 3 tiny hairs that were not there before, and they can only be seen close up in the mirror, and are black (They shouldnt be). Considering this it's the best minoxidil so far, no other minoxidil has worked for me, but the results are still not really worth it.

revivogen - did sweet F.A

laser comb - i know, i know, it's bullshit, and i'd completely agree, but i bought it before i had any `real` knowlege about this subject....

rogaine foam - nothing,

(current) derma-roller: not sure on this one, has anyone had any luck just doing this? i do it in combination with the left over retinol i have just to try to increase absorbtion, in combination with nanominox, a pretty poor outcome

spectral DNC-L - nothing, apart from a yellow sticky head

Megatek - not sure on this one, it used to burn sometimes, it made my hair `feel` thicker but i dont think it actually was.

Revita - Ket shampoo - no luck

other Ket shampoo's - no results.

Miconozole - nothing

spironolactone - also nothing


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im not very physically active anymore, i dont even really leave the house now'a days, i was quite active at one point, more then an hours bike riding (intense btw, not just 'rollin' along), walking around, doing some weights at home and half hour on exercise bike in the evenins. and i did this 5-6 days a week. My hair was better back then but thats the nature of this problem isnt it, the more time that passes the worse it gets, i dont think being `active` really made any difference.
 

karlg

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hairhoper said:
Also, I'm English too and managed to get a blood test easily, even just asking my GP for a private finasteride prescription, my Doctor suggested one immediately just to rule out other factors. I'm amazed you have such trouble getting a blood test. Have you considered going private?

Also to narrow down my previous question, if you used finasteride/dutasteride, how long did you use it for and what were the results?

I seem to get a very opresive response everytime i sit down infront of a docter, almost as if they'd made their mind up before i opened my mouth, i'd begin trying to explain things and within a minute they but in and blow me off (no pun intended...)

i used it for 7 months first time, and 4 months second time (this is when i got really pronounced sides and stopped)

both times, just sheding and increased rate of hair fallout, no maintainenece, no regrowth, just quicker progression
 

karlg

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freakout said:
Finasteride will turn you into an old man. It causes unpredictable medical conditions which are only beginning to be realized.


i personally really dont like propecia, it sends me off the rails even more then i am, i know it works well for some (lucky lucky) people, but it fucks me up in a bad way....
 

jksl

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I live in Canada, so i know how much of a piss-off universal healthcare is. I wish we would at least consider a two-tier system, but anyway, i digress..

If i were you, i'd get my thyroid tested.

Are you a substance abuser or ever have been? Ever dabble in coke, speed, or meth?
 

karlg

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hairhoper said:
I would obv recommend kicking the booze, boring as f*ck I know but it could be the first step in improving your mood.

if im honest, im not really motivated at all to improve my mood / wellbeing, im completely used to feeling this way i can just pick it up and run with it, and improving my mood wont help my hair, although im sure the booze doesnt help hair, it probobly makes things a bit worse, but it's pretty much the only thing to look forward to at the end of the week, or at the end of a really stressfull day.

i used to go around town on weekdays and weekends, sat in bars getting paraletic, spent so much money! so tesco and a bottle of vodka is the most socialable i get now, that and im sure some of the chemicals they use in the pumps in pubs around here end up in your drinks, even if it's only the tinyest ammount...
 

karlg

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jksl said:
I live in Canada, so i know how much of a piss-off universal healthcare is. I wish we would at least consider a two-tier system, but anyway, i digress..

If i were you, i'd get my thyroid tested.

Are you a substance abuser or ever have been? Ever dabble in coke, speed, or meth?

ive asked for thyroid tests, several times, and it's a "waste of (your) tax money, you dont have a thyroid problem". And they seem perfectly confident saying this without so much as even looking at my hair or running any tests (i wear a hat sometimes, specially when i have to be around people that can see my hair)


ive toyed with coke and mdma a handfull of times in my life, i enjoy them but have no sources (and intend to keep it that way), otherwise i'd be dead by now, ive got an addictive personallity. i also played around with that meow sh*t for a few weeks, ended up building a huge tollerence to it within a week and a half and then just lost interest when i couldnt get high from it anymore.


apart from that, i smoke a bit of weed now and then, the above stuff ive never really done on a repeat or regular basis, i smoke weed weekly though, however at the start of 2010 i quit weed, completely, on the spot on new years eve, and didnt touch it again untill the start of 2011.
 

karlg

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karlg said:
ive toyed with coke and mdma a handfull of times in my life, i enjoy them but have no sources (and intend to keep it that way), otherwise i'd be dead by now, ive got an addictive personallity. i also played around with that meow sh*t for a few weeks, ended up building a huge tollerence to it within a week and a half and then just lost interest when i couldnt get high from it anymore.

oh, and when i tried `meow` that was back in july 2009, and the coke n mdma etc.. prolly once a year, if not less, since 2006 untill i tried meow, i havnt done anything like that since the `meow` stuff.
 

Thom

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Take into account all of the city chemicals put into our water. I don't think it affects everyone but I know my scalp is quite sensitive to them. Probably not the case with you but worth a thought.

The shedding phase of finasteride is supposed to begin about 7 months in. Most people say results don't really start showing with most people until around the 12th month. Some time it even takes 2 years for the best results to take effect. Just what I've read anyway, I'm on month 8 and just got past the shedding.
 

karlg

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i wish i could take finasteride, the only problem is it makes me shed within 4-6 weeks and it doesn't stop, i couldn't gamble taking finasteride for like, 2 years, or even a year, because I can garuntee i will end up bald, have gyno for the rest of my life, and put on weight permenantly. every time ive tried finasteride, even for a short while, or topically, it just does damage and speeds things up, even after i stop taking it... i think i get Hyperandrogenism when i take it, and it never quite goes away...
 
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