Spironolactone...where does it truly fit in

[HairyN]

I've just read some articles on PubMed.com where they used Spironolactone to successfully treat people with hirsutism....meaning exessive hairgrowth

i also just read of a guy who posted on a forum somewhere while i was looking up more info on spironolactone who said his hair THINNED out while on oral spironolactone....topical...internal...its the same drug...it'll have the same effect just not as strong as normal

im thinking of coming off of it....

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=3310825

 

[Fallout Boy]

i heard it reduces body hair and does the opposite for hair on the scalp??

i could be way off but thats just what i read on a forum

 

[northeastguy]

that was me

that was me over on Hairsite. But PLEASE as i stated do not take my experience as what would/could happen. My body is F'd up man I don't know what's going on with it. It COULD have been a number of things but it really started when I added oral spironolactone. But read through posts, there are more positive than negative I believe so thats what prompted me to try it. It's not sound to just take one persons experience and decide to or not to use it.

As far as body hair, yeah it decreased and that in itself was a major plus!!! If I go bald anyhow, I'd go back on spironolactone just for that in itself! Just be careful whatever you do.

 

[The Gardener]

No, the study makes perfect sense.

DHT is what causes a lot of changes related to puberty and ageing. As we get older, most men start facing thinning scalp hair, and increasing body hair. DHT is the trigger for both.

Thus, using spironolactone would thicken hair that is programmed to thin when DHT binds to it, and would also thin out hair that is programmed to thicken when DHT binds to it.

 

[GeminiX]

Gardner is absolutely correct.

spironolactone is one of the two main drugs (along with Androcur) commonly prescribed to transgendered patients.

Androcur is somewhat stronger thatn spironolactone, but is also illegal in the US, it also has some nasty side effects.

spironolactone and Androcur will have a dramatic impact on ones body reducing body hair to fine downy vellus, and reducing hair in the pubic area into a pretty small V shape.

D

 

[juststarting]

Uhm, the study was done in women...

 

[The Gardener]

That doesn't change the chemical implications of the results. Females with excess body hair get such from an overabundance of the same chemicals that cause increased body hair, thicker beards, and thinner scalp hair in males.

Besides, the Italian spironolactone study was done on males, and showed it to be an effective tool in combatting male pattern baldness.

 

[thin=depressed]

spironolactone is used for high blood pressure resulting in better scalp circulation and a diuretic resulting in less water retension in scalp as well.

 

[The Gardener]

I think the spironolactone/diuretic issue is a secondary thing. Besides, Minoxidil is a well known facilitator of water retention. If water retention were an issue, why is minoxidil so effective?

Additionally, given that spironolactone is the predominant chemical taken orally by males wishing to become transgendered males, I don't think that any 'water retention' issue is what is making spironolactone effective. Taking diuretics orally does not normally tend to make males take on female characteristics. Taking an anti-DHT treatment orally does. And for hairloss sufferers, applying this anti-androgen topically is shown to be an effective anti-androgen that inhibits DHT in the scalp, thus resulting in an offset of male pattern baldness thinning.

 

[thin=depressed]

I think the spironolactone/diuretic issue is a secondary thing. Besides, Minoxidil is a well known facilitator of water retention. If water retention were an issue, why is minoxidil so effective?

Additionally, given that spironolactone is the predominant chemical taken orally by males wishing to become transgendered males, I don't think that any 'water retention' issue is what is making spironolactone effective. Taking diuretics orally does not normally tend to make males take on female characteristics. Taking an anti-DHT treatment orally does. And for hairloss sufferers, applying this anti-androgen topically is shown to be an effective anti-androgen that inhibits DHT in the scalp, thus resulting in an offset of male pattern baldness thinning.

well said Gardener, although once again keep in mind the tissue problems associated with male pattern baldness such as tissue inflammation which is a tissue issue and not a follicle issue. Note that retinoic acid, and azelaic acid, and copper peptides are all skin tissue health enhancing products that indirectly better our hair. Tissue woes have much to do with our hairs problem...

 

[Bryan]

well said Gardener, although once again keep in mind the tissue problems associated with male pattern baldness such as tissue inflammation which is a tissue issue and not a follicle issue. Note that retinoic acid, and azelaic acid, and copper peptides are all skin tissue health enhancing products that indirectly better our hair. Tissue woes have much to do with our hairs problem...

It's interesting that of all the well-known products for hairloss, Proxiphen with its SODs and TEMPO/TEMPOL and PBN is the one that focuses the most on the tissue-regeneration aspects of balding (I use the term loosely), and the least on the antiandrogenic aspects that most people usually obsess about.

BTW, I'm asking again (for the third time) where that information is that azelaic acid supposedly helps our hair.

Bryan

 

[Old Baldy]

It's not interesting Bryan, it's smart.

I don't have any studies that show azelaic acid promotes hair growth, etc.

Oh, I forgot to mention Bryan, that the Revivogen site cites a 1988 study that azelaic acid, when mixed with zinc and B6, reduces DHT. (I know you are aware of that study but that's all I have. Not much at all.)

 

[thin=depressed]

It's not interesting Bryan, it's smart.

I don't have any studies that show azelaic acid promotes hair growth, etc.

Oh, I forgot to mention Bryan, that the Revivogen site cites a 1988 study that azelaic acid, when mixed with zinc and B6, reduces DHT. (I know you are aware of that study but that's all I have. Not much at all.)

I've read that same study. BTW for some odd reason Bryan is feeling schitzo thinking we are in cohort on some kind of misleading scheme. "Its not interesting Bryan, its smart." The products I mention are for skin health.................................end of story

 

[Bryan]

I've read that same study. BTW for some odd reason Bryan is feeling schitzo thinking we are in cohort on some kind of misleading scheme.

I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. I don't think you do, either.

Furthermore, this is my FOURTH request for the study which you claimed shows that azelaic acid is good for hair. If you don't answer me this time, I'll just assume that you made the whole thing up.

Bryan

 

[Old Baldy]

Thin, I think Bryan was admitting scalp health is important. That's why he brought up Prox. (I was being a smart aleck, you know, "messing" with him.)

 

[thin=depressed]

I've read that same study. BTW for some odd reason Bryan is feeling schitzo thinking we are in cohort on some kind of misleading scheme.

I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. I don't think you do, either.

Furthermore, this is my FOURTH request for the study which you claimed shows that azelaic acid is good for hair. If you don't answer me this time, I'll just assume that you made the whole thing up.

Bryan

Bryan, If I don't answer you this time its because I don't care to cater to ya. Nothing personal, Go ahead and label me. Also, ANYTHING that helps tissue health will indirectly improve follicle health..................If azelaic acid improves skin health it will improve follicle health. Its that simple.

 

[Bryan]

Bryan, If I don't answer you this time its because I don't care to cater to ya.

I'll remember that, my friend.

 

[Old Baldy]

Thin: I don't want to jump in here but - oh, what the heck, it never stopped me before.

When I first started reading about male pattern baldness I tried to find studies showing how azelaic acid helped. I couldn't find anything really conclusive. It is a "natural" substance and, since I'm a "natural" wacko, I was disappointed that there was nothing really out there to support paying so much for azelaic acid. (Not to mention it is a prescription medicine - I think?)

So I've just avoided it since then.

 

[IBM]

Thus, using spironolactone would thicken hair that is programmed to thin when DHT binds to it, and would also thin out hair that is programmed to thicken when DHT binds to it.

That's the effect i'm having with oral spironolactone. The existing hair is more thicken.

 

[docj077]

spironolactone's hair regrowth and maintenance capabilities are two fold. First it acts at the androgen receptor to prevent androgen binding. Second, it works at the mineralocorticoid receptor to prevent the binding of aldosterone in follicles, as well, which is known to interact quite effectively with other nuclear receptors. High blood pressure = high aldosterone. It's a potent diuretic, but topically, that's not its main mechanism of action, nor does it pull fluid off the scalp, because there simply isn't any evidence for it.

Seriously, how many people here have stasis dermatitis on their scalps? Probably, nobody. Again, there is no evidence for third spacing of fluid in men with male pattern baldness.